88 thoughts on “Shin Bet Murders Palestinians Who Killed Three Israeli Youths

  1. @ Richard,
    first of all it says so in the Haaretz article i’ve linked.
    they even wrote they fired on the walls in order to make them come out – just has i said without even reading it when i wrote the comment (sometimes you skip a few steps like the throwing stones and flashbangs if you have prior intel that the suspects are armed and dangerous).
    they gapped a hole in the building after no one came out- meaning, if this was a hit they would have gone stealthily, gaping a hole meaning two things: 1. there was no intention of sending soldiers (swat) inside to search for them bcz it is dangerous. 2. they had to surround the building prior of doing that – and if there’s a bulldozer there’s an armada of vehicles – everyone knows you are there.
    the article also states that there were other arrests – usually when going on a hit (not an arrest) there are no other military activities in the area. but multiple arrests are very common.
    about footage – you know that even if there were footage they wouldn’t be HD quality but rather helmet mounted camera that would give anyone who doesn’t believe the israeli security forces before hand a chance to say that you see nothing, and it doesn’t prove anything and that they were rigged and edited – seen a few of this incidents. there’s some footage available in the media and sound bites of the actual COM.

    @ Mary and Richard, you are right – although in many israeli eyes this result (them being dead) is preferred since they wouldn’t be released in a few years in some 1 soldier for 1000 prisoners swap, the right way was to arrest them.
    but sometimes reality hits and we should face it. i truly believe, with all my experience as an officer in one of the infantry units this was no target killing – but rather an attempt to arrest if all went smoothly and they had surrendered.
    btw, the Fogel family murders were arrested as well – a similar heinous crime. why weren’t they executes as you claim it to be our response in this situations?

  2. “It is completely unacceptable to publish claims unsubstantiated.”

    Is it, Richard? The kindly substantiate the existence of your “source” and his claims.

    1. My source’s reports have been substantiated repeatedly by subsequent events. He’s a confidential source hence I don’t reveal information about him without betraying him & losing him as a source. That may not upset you, but it would me. So no thank you. In case you were wondering I don’t write this blog for you neither do I have anything to prove to you.

      I have offered slightly more background information about him in previous posts, which you “re welcome to research & explore.

  3. @ Richard,
    The head of this terror cell was arrested 2 months ago – captured ALIVE by the same operating unit.
    “http://news.walla.co.il/?w=/2689/2772908”
    You didn’t report it – at least not that i’ve seen it. What’s the difference then? he didn’t started firing at the soldiers.

    anyone who’s been in an infantry unit in israel knows that what happened in Hebron was standard procedure:
    1. you surround the house and call for everyone to come out.
    2. if they do great – if they don’t you start escalating your means – first stones (some units do that and some don’t) after that flashbangs, after that live ammunition to the walls of the house etc etc. the purpose of this is to make the suspects come out without having soldiers risk their live by going in – usually it works in the very early stages.
    3. when someone is shooting from inside the house – you definitely don’t go in! – you do exactly as SWAT did. you fire back and unless he surrenders immediately (which in this case they didn’t) you deteriorate your means up until you fire lau’s rockets – and either kill or make sure that the threat is gone in some other way. again, if the suspects surrenders you stop. when they started shooting they knew what would be the outcome and there was no way soldiers would be put t risk to capture them alive.
    this happened before and will happen again – it has nothing to do with conspiracy etc. it’s how it works according to the basic rules of engagement.

    1. @ shay: My source, who has a higher IDF rank, length of service, acts of valor, & knowledge than you, told me it was a “targeted killing.” You can deceive & delude yourself into believing in IDF righteousness. But the rest of us know what really happened.

      Why would anyone believe the two victims were firing? Do you not think the IDF filmed the incident? Why don’t they show you the video to prove there was firing? So if you have no physical evidence, why would you ever believe the liars of the IDF?

      1. “You’re source.” Would you be willing to take a polygraph test regarding the veracity of your assertion that you have a high ranking IDF member as a source? You will not be asked to reveal any identifying information about this source. You will only be asked questions to verify that such a source in fact exists and that you have seen sufficient evidence of the credentials of this source.

        1. @ Adam Dayton: Yeah, I’ll do that just before I ban you from posting another comment here. I’ll do that because you ‘re such an important reader that I crave your acceptance & respect. And I’ll do that just after you give a lie detector test to every Israeli reporter who’s quoted an anonymous source.

          In short, go soak your head.

      2. @ Richard,
        i know target killing happen. usually it’s not like that – usually it’s more covert nothing like what we see here. if they really wanted them dead from the get go – there’s lots of better solutions to use then what happened that are being used. you don’t come with an armada of vehicles and surround the house if you want somebody dead without him knowing you are coming – there we’re bulldozers over there! to me it actually looks just about a normal arrest – and SWAT did everything by the book under the circumstances.
        and what’s so unbelievable about them opening fire? they killed 3 teens – is it that so far fetched?!
        and again i ask. if they wanted the entire cell dead and to quite everyone so no one would know the truth – why was the head of the cell arrested and not killed?

        1. @Shay “They killed 3 teens.”
          Really. And how do you know this?

          1. @ Mary,
            Israel knew almost from the get go who did it. they’ve also arrested the terror cell leader a few weeks ago – which led eventually to them – he confessed to the all thing by the way.
            they also went under the radar the exact same day and their family didn’t know where they were up until now. during the investigation the shin bet exposed a network that protected them – the last one to be arrested pointed them to the house they were hiding in.
            i bet there’s much more – they were incarcerated before – so all personal information was already known (finger prints etc)
            then there’s the tape and and car they left behind.
            and none of that matters if you shoot at SWAT team trying to arrest you – as i mentioned before – usually in target killing you don’t surround and then call the suspects out – so by firing at them there was going to be only one outcome at the end.
            you are right that under law they are ‘suspects’ but let’s not kid ourselves as to think that they aren’t the real killers.

            link to haaretz.co.il

          2. @ shay:

            none of that matters if you shoot

            There is absolutely no proof that they shot at anyone. Nor any proof that the murderers called to them. Can you prove this claim? Again, I’d love to see the IDF videotape. If they didn’t make one it proves what their original intent was.

            As for whether they’re the real killers, again you can’t make such a claim because your country refused to arrest and prove them guilty. So you only get to call them “alleged.” You’ve lost the moral right to claim anything about them since you murdered them.

  4. Richard,
    You’re a sick person. Loving those who wish to kill you and hating those who would protect you is a real disease.

    1. @ Yovav Katz: The IDF doesn’t “protect” you & certainly not me. It actually places all Jews in danger.

      There’s that Israeli Zionist hegemonic thinking that you represent all Jews.

      1. Yovav Katz’ reasoning is not unusual. Militarized nations create a sense of existential fear in their civilian populations, towards “the enemy”. This then justifies any action the government or its Police and military forces take against this mindless, faceless, enemy and the fear-driven populace feel grateful that they are being protected. Few dare to voice opposition because the same public will roundly vilify them for being unpatriotic and helping “the enemy” drive “us” out of existence. The US, India, Pakistan, Israel and increasingly, Western nations are exhibiting such tendencies and the target du jour is Islam and Muslims.

      2. “It (IDF) actually places all Jews in danger.”

        Jews were hated before the IDF and the state of Israel existed. and not ‘all jews’ would agree to that statement.

        1. @ shay: I don’t really care who agrees or disagrees with my statement. I & almost every other reader of this blog and many Jews know this to be true.

          This is not traditional anti-Semitism. The issue is the hate generated by Israeli slaughter which motivates Islamists to want to attack Israelis (and sometimes Jews if they can’t find Israelis).

    2. Shortening a Life Sentence …

      (MAD) – Physicians For Human Rights-Israel made recommendations regarding the urgent need to transfer prison medical services from the Israeli Prison Service (IPS) to the Ministry of Health, due to the dilemmas of dual loyalty of IPS medical staff and the primacy given to political and security considerations at the expense of prisoners’ health and well-being.

  5. One reason why Israel is getting away with the continuation of its murderous grip on Gaza is the present hysteria about returning jihadists and the terrible things they might do in their home country. This hysteria is stirred up from various sites. Secret services have a vested interest in inflating their findings. Governments in increasing their power. Parties such as Israel in inducing the world to look the other way.

    If jihadists hate us because of our freedoms, as the tale goes, than they have now a little less reason for doing so. In Australia the conservative government is using the whole thing to increase, yet again, the power of the executive and to commit the country, yet again, to action in the Middle East without parliamentary scrutiny. Labor, scared that it might miss out on the populist effects of the hysteria, is going along. Only the Greens are taking a principled and commonsensical stance.

    To treat all returning jihadists the same way even though there is little information about the motivation and actions of many of them (there must be naive and misled boys among them) is having the opposite effect to that which was intended. The state is creating enemies of people, some of whom might not have been so if this populist hysteria was not guiding policy.

    1. What 13 years of America’s WOT and a few years of Geert Wilders does to a nation! Not to mention creating the divide in families as well. A classic example of mass hysteria, media e.a. The murder of Pim Fortuyn played a key role in Dutch politics, the assassin is out free on bail.

  6. Kill, rather than bring to trial, that’s typical of Israel.

  7. Richard, your bias is remarkable. Your so-called evidence for the fact that this was an execution is an unnamed “Israeli source” (was he or she an eye-witness?) and a Palestinian governor who refers to murders of Israeli teenagers as “martyrs.”

    1. @ djf: Why would you believe you need to watch an execution in order to know it took place? You mean if someone watched an execution, then told you friend about it, you wouldn’t believe him because he wasn’t there?

      I’ll take my source’s track record anytime over doubters like you.

      1. You don’t have a source, Richard. You make things up and as a result, nobody in the mainstream media takes you seriously. You’re just another guy with a blog.

        1. @adam Dayton: Such a short stay here. What a pity! Since you believe everything I write here lacks credibility I’m going to relieve you of the boredom of having to read and comment on it here. You wouldn’t want to be wasting your time here anyway.

  8. These men could have been captured alive if the Israeli establishment had wanted them to be, but this was clearly not their wish. Israel had so much to hide in this case: For instance the fact that they knew from day 1 that the kidnapped young men were dead (because of the phone recording) but that they kept this secret so that they could conduct razzia’s of the West Bank for weeks to root out Hamas. The weeks of incitement that followed also caused the murder of Mohammed Abu Khdeir and led to the the massacre in Gaza.

    Such an important case would have surely warranted a procedure in court, with testimonies from the accused and a proper investigation in which everything would have come out into the open.

    It is so clear that Israel had so much to hide in this case that it could not afford such a trial. ‘Auf der Flucht erschossen’ was their way out. (In other words: Premeditated murder).

    Even proud Israeli nationalists should be worried and ashamed of what happened today: If your state is such a beakon of righteousness, why deal with the suspect in such an important case in such a way? Do you not see the signs of fascism and an authoritarian state approaching?

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