38 thoughts on “Bibi: First We’ll Take Tehran, Then We’ll Take Istanbul – Tikun Olam תיקון עולם إصلاح العالم
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  1. Since Turkey is a member of NATO, wouldn’t the US have to come to its defense in case of any attack? How would that play out with an Israeli invasion of Istanbul? What do you think the US will do?

    1. Richard’s article didn’t say anything about Israel invading Istanbul. He was talking about Israel invading Turkey’s sphere of influence – in Cyprus. But why should that surprise anyone. Israel is merely extending its tentacles on behalf of its parent, the US. They’re in this together. It is obvious the US intends to rule the world, and Israel is its henchman. Capo to the godfather.

      1. The article title is: “Bibi: First We’ll Take Tehran, Then We’ll Take Istanbul”

        How is Bibi meant to take Istanbul other than by invasion?

          1. Well, you did give the impression that aggressive action toward Iran would be followed by the same in Turkey.

    2. It’s been decades since the US last annoyed Turkey in any way whatsoever. Legally, the US cannot help Israel attack Turkey, rationally, it wouldn’t want to.

      1. The US wouldn’t need to “help” Turkey, as much as Turkey could, having extensively trained with, “help themselves” to B61 bombs. If the NATO base(s) were to become targets, I don’t see the USAF standing in the way of Turkish armed forces using these bombs, per treaty agreements.

    3. “Since Turkey is a member of NATO, wouldn’t the US have to come to its defense in case of any attack?”

      Not if Turkey fires first.

      Wars of aggression are illegal, therefore all military treaties (e.g. NATO) bind the signatories to a mutual DEFENSE against an aggressor.

      So if Turkey attacks Israeli assets then it can not invoke the terms of the NATO treaty, but if Israel attacks Turkey then, yes, Ankara can call upon help from NATO forces.

    4. Bob: “How would that play out with an Israeli invasion of Istanbul?”

      That’s going a little over the top, don’t you think?

      has no border with Turkey.
      has no sea-lift capabilities whatsoever.
      its navy is no match for the Turkish Navy.
      its airforce is well matched by the Turkish airforce.

      Israel’s “ability” to invade Istanbul is non-existent.

      Maybe a “60 seconds over Tokyo” style air raid, though the IDF wouldn’t want to try it twice.

      But not a “Storm the Dardanelles!!!” invasion, no.

      Much stronger armies than the IDF have tried that trick, and they never even managed to get off the beaches.

      1. It was mainly in response to the title of the article “Bibi: First We’ll Take Tehran, Then We’ll Take Istanbul” which seems to suggest Israel invading Turkey – how else would they take Istanbul?

  2. We can also be sure that no matter how much Israel derives from these resources, it won’t stop taking Uncle Sam’s money,

  3. I suppose the involvement of Turkey in Israels’ sphere of influence , in your opinion , does not count . This sarticle is so biased and one sided .

  4. No criticism of Iranian projection of power, via Hezbollah and Islamic Jihad. No criticism of Turkey’s 35 year illegal occupation of Northern Cyprus.

    Just the daily grinding down of Israel.

    BTW. Has Turkey asked to negotiate their claim to the gas fields?

    1. This is your last comment along the lines of “you always beat up Israel.” I’m tired of it & you’ve become a broken record. You have a substantive comment to make? Make it. If all you have is whining–spare us. So you decide whether it’s more important to whine or participate. If it’s whining you want–go elsewhere.

    2. If the US were not funding Israel’s “projection”, I might think you have a point, although this space, this blog, is for Israel. Start your own Turkey-focused blog.

      US taxpayers are slowly learning how much of their tax monies go to Israel and I see the resentment growing all the time. Why should American taxpayers make a handful of wealthy Israelis even wealthier, the scenario Richard describes correctly, I think, to the exclusion of social justice? I keep thinking what $3.2 billion could do here in the US year after year.

    3. ***Article Four of the Treaty of Guarantee gives the right to guarantors to take action with the sole aim of re-establishing the state of affairs.***

      Atrocities against the Turkish Cypriot community were committed during the invasion of the island. Contemporaneous newspapers also reported about the forceful exodus of the Turkish Cypriots from their homes. According to the Times journal issued in 1964, threats, shootings and attempts of arson are committed against the Turkish Cypriots to force them out of their homes.[52] Daily Express wrote that “25,000 Turks have already been forced to leave their homes”.[53] The Guardian reported a massacre of Turks at Limassol on 16 February 1964.[54]

      There were also massacres against the Turkish Cypriots during the invasion of the island, including the Maratha, Santalaris and Aloda massacre, in which 126 people were killed on 14 August 1974[55][56] and the Tochni (Taşkent) massacre.[57] The missing persons list of the Republic of Cyprus confirms that 83 Turkish Cypriots disappeared in Tochni on 14 August 1974.[58] A veteran member of the EOKA B, Andreas Dimitriu, stated in an interview that EOKA B worked in conjunction with Greek Cypriot officials at the time to murder 89 Turkish Cypriots at Taşkent.[citation needed][59] The Washington Post covered another news of atrocity in which it is written that: “In a Greek raid on a small Turkish village near Limassol, 36 people out of a population of 200 were killed. The Greeks said that they had been given orders to kill the inhabitants of the Turkish villages before the Turkish forces arrived.

  5. This article is built on the premise that Turkey has some international or maritime rights regarding Cyprus. Since Turkish Cyprus was taken by force and is recognized by no other state, it no right to claim an interest in the area. If Israel is encroaching on Turkish terrority in Cyprus and the Turks have the right to defend it, then by the same token foreign involvement in the occupied terroritories can might bring the same response.

    It’s difficult to play it both ways. You can’t claim on one hand that Israeli occupation of the West Bank is illegal and unrecognized, but that we should recognize Turkey’s rights in Northern Cyprus. Double standards indeed.

    1. Turkey has no more rights on Cyprus than Greece does. Yet Greece props up the Greek Cypriots no less than Turkey props up the Turks. This all started you’ll recall when Greece was run by a bunch of tin pot dictators who were stirring up trouble which Turkey felt it had to forestall.

      I’m in favor of Greece & TUrkey resolving their Cypriot dispute just as I’m in favor of Israel not using military power to clinch its claim to the gas field. How ’bout you?

  6. And who will protect Gaza’s (i.e., Palestinians’) interest/share in Med Oil/gas production? Looks like either an out-and-out steal by Israel or else a “trust” for the benefit of Gaza with israel as “trustee” all to me fudged much as the oil-income-trust for Native Americans was fudged (the money stolen by the oil companies).

  7. The Greek government isn’t Soveriegn on Cyprus, either. Though it sometimes liked to pretend otherwise, before events and Angela Merkel, overtook it.

    The republic of Cyprus is a member of the EU, like Greece, and a member of the Commonwealth, very much unlike Greece, notwithstanding that Cricket is the national sport on Corfu.

    This is probably meant to punish the UK as much as Turkey, we’re “disobedient dogs” you know.

    Greek democracy having been suspended in favour of rule by EU-appointed technocrats, it is unlikely that there is any conscious Greek government policy on this issue at all, until the German government has had time to determine what Greek policy should be.

    The Cypriot government’s freedom to make such an agreement may also be constrained by the UN, which is still overseeing the ongoing process of normalising relations between North and South Cyprus (it’s effectively the South which joined the EU, though the wording is intentionally flexible.)

    A delicate situation, into which Israel’s delinquent leadership chooses to crap.

  8. RE: “There is only one way to resolve territorial disputes of the nature of the one concerning the Cypriot gas field, negotiation. Israel, however, doesn’t believe it negotiation. It believes in naked projections of military strength.” ~ R.S.


    (excerpt) The Betar Movement (בית”ר, also spelled Beitar) is a Revisionist Zionist youth movement founded in 1923 in Riga, Latvia, by Vladimir (Ze’ev) Jabotinsky. Betar has been traditionally linked to the original Herut and then Likud political parties of Israel, and was closely affiliated with the pre-Israel Revisionist Zionist splinter group Irgun Zevai Leumi. It was one of many movements and youth groups arising at that time out of a worldwide emergence of fascism.[1] Some of the most prominent politicians of Israel were Betarim in their youth, most notably Prime Ministers Yitzhak Shamir and Menachem Begin, the latter of whom idolized Jabotinsky.[2]…
    . . . The group initially praised Mussolini for his anti-communism and fascist principles, leading it to adopt the black uniform shirt of Italian fascism for a short period. Mussolini’s invasion of Abyssinia, however, was seen as “cowardly” by Betar and led them to break with him shortly after.[8]…

    SOURCE – http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betar

    P.S. FROM TED RALL, 07/22/10: …Umberto Eco’s 1995 essay Eternal Fascism describes the cult of action for its own sake under fascist regimes and movements: “Action being beautiful in itself, it must be taken before, or without, reflection. Thinking is a form of emasculation.”
    SOURCE – http://www.commondreams.org/view/2010/07/22-1

    P.P.S. It appears to me that Israel/Zionism has come to resemble what Umberto Eco referred to as “fascist regimes and movements”, and consequently Zionism ascribes to the “cult of action for its own sake” (e.g. Israel’s settlement project in the West Bank, Israel’s determination to bomb Iran, etc).

    1. P.P.S. RE: “the cult of action for its own sake under fascist regimes and movements” ~ Umberto Eco’s 1995 essay Eternal Fascism

      THE “BE(I)TARIM” IN ACTION: Hundreds of soccer fans crowd Jerusalem mall: ‘Death to Arabs!’, by Annie Robbins, Mondoweiss, 3/24/12

      (excerpt)…Chanting “Death to Arabs,” hundreds of Beitar soccer fans crowded into a mall in Jerusalem after their team won a match and what spilled out …words escape me:

      The Independent:

      Hundreds of fans, mostly teenagers, descended on busy Malha Mall, jumping on tables, waving scarves, and chanting “Death to Arabs”.
      When a group of fans started to heckle and spit on Palestinian women dining with their children in the food hall, the centre’s Arab cleaning staff rushed to their defence and chased the fans off. But moments later, the fans returned, and started to attack the Arab staff.
      “They [the fans] caught some of them and beat the hell out of them,” Yair, the Jewish owner of a bakery in the shopping centre, told Israel’s Haaretz newspaper. “They hurled people into shops, and smashed them against shop windows. … One cleaner was attacked by some 20 people, poor guy.” The brawl might have turned deadly, but food hall staff refused to respond to fans’ demands for knives and sticks…

      SOURCE – http://mondoweiss.net/2012/03/hundreds-of-soccer-fans-crowd-jerusalem-mall-death-to-arabs.html

      Jerusalem Day celebrations PART1 : Provocations. (VIDEO, 03:49) – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NorLZCkCcuY

      1. Dickerson-

        I guess I missed the connection your comments here had to do with the comment thread. Fascism should have no place in Israel. The article about the hooligans from the soccer game is a terrible thing, as is anybody who yells those type of statements. I don’t think this represents the majority of Israelis just as the hooligans at Brit games represent the majority of English (hope not, anyway).

        And as for the video about “Jerusalem Day”. Nobody on that video yelled any profanities from what I saw/heard. No death threats, no physical confrontations etc.

        Does it happen, yes it does and THAT is not good (Jew physically threatening Arabs and the reverse). And it isn’t only the hooligans at soccer games.

        Today’s Yediot Achronot had an article about a Groom who was brutally attacked by an Arab mob at the Mount of Olives. On his way to his wedding he went there to pay respect at his mother’s grave (he along with his driver in a decorated “wedding car”- nothing provocative). According to the article scores of Arabs started throwing stones and attacking them. If it wasn’t for police intevention it was projected they would have been killed. No better, and a bit worse (no “hooligan/game-frenzy” to hide behind) in this blatant racist attack. The article also reported that Jews visting the Mt. of Olives have been attacked several times and it has become a dangerous thing to do.

        1. The Beitar fans don’t represent the “majority of Israelis?” These are the fans of one of Israel’s most popular soccer teams. They rampage like this after every game & are known throughout Israel for their disgusting chants. The Israeli police do nothing to stop the curses, insults & hooliganism & yet you claim they don’t represent the majority of Israelis? Who’re you foolin’?

          Last Jerusalem Day there was an equally disgusting show of Israeli racism. I don’t know what’s on that video, but if you didn’t hear disgusting racist chants then you were watching the wrong video. It happened. Stop being in denial. I don’t mind if you defend Israel, but don’t defend the indefensible. It’s an insult.

          I also detest tit-for-tat commenting in which you try to prove that because Palestinians are racist it justifies Israelis being so.

          1. Yes, those soccer fans have lots of hooligans among them. Its’ one of the reason I won’t/don’t go to the games. If you followed a bit more of local sports you’d see that there are efforts to combat these insulting and senseless outbreaks by fans. It is an up-hill battle I’ll admit, but it certainly isn’t ignored completely.

            Give me a break, you want to tell me that these folks represent the majority of several million Israelis.? Go prove it. I could easily say the same thing about Brits, Irish or others. If you want to go that route one can easily say that the thousands of Palestinians who chant all sorts of wonderful comments about Jews, Israel etc. represent a majority of their countryman. I’m of the opinion that “the emptiest barrel makes the most noise”… or simply these minority loud-mouths don’t represent the majority of their fellow countrymen… both Israeli or Palestinian.

            As for my comments, of course you would. Yet you do the same in many cases. A pro-Israel comment is made and you have to respond to the opposite. I’m only doing the same here.

            Perhaps if you and some of your usual commentors would show some balance in your remarks when it comes to comments disparaging Israel, I wouldn’t be so inclined to let the other side be heard.

            As said many times before, it’s your blog, you’ll report what you want to…. why shouldn’t I be allowed to comment back to other commentor’s claims and remarks.

            I’m not trying to justify that just because one side does some racist act it gives validity to the other side to do the same,BOTH acts are dispicable and defenseless. But it is important to put some perspective and balance into what is commented here.

            Without balance…without persepective and both sides of a point being aired how can you get a better understanding of what’s going on?

            I know the purpose of your website is not to centered around a balanced news reporting of events involving the P/I conflict, so I don’t expect it. But that doesn’t mean I can’t make comments… just like you and others do, about the “other side” of things as well? How about alittle balance huh?

          2. So I went and checked “the video” again. On THAT video there was no disgusting racist chants, unless “Am Yisrael Chai” and singing a song from the Hagaddah “Yehi Sh’Amda” falls into your category of racist chants.

            I’m commenting on THAT video link Dickerson posted. If you’re going to comment on what I said, at least have the decency to view what I’m referring to. I’m not wasting my time surfing YouTube to find what YOU claim to have seen.

            If you care to pay attention to my comments, you’ll see I don’t deny anything that actually happens. I am strong proponant of BOTH sides NOT using racist chants, violence and abuse in their trying to champion their causes.

            The “insult” here is that you make a comment about what I say without even bother to check the source and then claim I saw the wrong video. I took the time to scan the video and heard no racial slurs.

          3. You implied that because you didn’t see racism on a single video that none occurred, which is wrong. You couldn’t be bothered to discover that racist Israelis marching through Arab neighborhoods of East Jerusalem chanted racist slogans & insults. You only wish to deny they appear on a single video you watched. God forbid you should have to acknowledge that the disgusting things were actually said by Israeli Jewish settler Arab haters.

            As for being a strong proponent of “both sides” opposing racism, frankly I haven’t heard you denounce any Israeli racism though I have heard you make tons of excuses for Israeli behavior & attitudes.

            How can their be a “battle” to combat Beitar Yerushalayim racist fans when police won’t arrest any after they commit a pogrom in a shopping mall and after the head of the Beitar club defends them?

            I’m not interested in Brits, Irish or others. I write about Israel. And Israel has some of the most racist fans in the world living in one of the incendiary regions in the world.

            As for “thousands” of Palestinians who allegedly chant about Jews, what ever are you talking about? Are you dreaming or have you made it up?

          4. No reply buttong below-

            You just said:

            As for being a strong proponent of “both sides” opposing racism, frankly I haven’t heard you denounce any Israeli racism though I have heard you make tons of excuses for Israeli behavior & attitudes.

            WRONG! First of all I don’t make excuses… certainly not “tons”,(I don’t comment that much here) for anybody’s behavior.

            And If you’d bother to read what JUST I wrote:

            “…BOTH acts are dispicable and defenseless.”

            “….and If you care to pay attention to my comments, you’ll see I don’t deny anything that actually happens. I am strong proponant of BOTH sides NOT using racist chants, violence and abuse in their trying to champion their causes.”

            If your too obtuse to figure it out.. I’ll help you:

            I despise and denounce ANYbody, Israeli, Jew, Palestinian, Muslim, Christain, Hindu…(you name it) who yell racist slogans and dare to chant “Death to-fill-in-the-blank”.

            And FYI I don’t object to reading/hearing/debating Israel’s short-comings… otherwise I wouldn’t bother to put up with you style of commenting. Yet I reserve my right to respond to comments as such… not as a “hasbarist”, (hell, you’ve got plenty of those) but my own observations, which might be in line with thinking OTHER than your own.

          5. Don’t be obtuse. Of course I read the words you wrote in THIS comment claiming you oppose Israeli racism. What I meant was you’ve never before here written criticizing anything Israel has done as far as I recall. That meaning is evident to anyone with good reading comprehension skills, which you seem to lack.

          6. Response to below:

            My reading comprehension skills are just fine. I’m not so sure about your memory… or your fairness/honesty to those who agree to your thinking.

            In the past I’ve posted comments that concur with my sentiments here against racism or other issues Israel should grapple with.

            I’ll choose to comment when and how I want to respond. I don’t need you to watch-dog me about how many times I may have or not said something I state here.

            I’ve had enough of this back-and-forth banter.

    2. P.P.P.P.S. SPEAKING OF “BE(I)TARIM”, ALSO SEE: “Bibi and the Yo-Yos”, by Uri Avnery, Antiwar.com, 05/26/11:

      (excerpt) It was all rather disgusting.
      There they were, the members of the highest legislative bodies of the world’s only superpower, flying up and down like so many yo-yos, applauding wildly, every few minutes or seconds, the most outrageous lies and distortions of Binyamin Netanyahu.
      It was worse than the Syrian parliament during a speech by Bashar Assad, where anyone not applauding could find himself in prison. Or Stalin’s Supreme Soviet, when showing less than sufficient respect could have meant death.
      What the American Senators and Congressmen feared was a fate worse than death. Anyone remaining seated or not applauding wildly enough could have been caught on camera – and that amounts to political suicide. It was enough for one single congressman to rise and applaud, and all the others had to follow suit. Who would dare not to?
      The sight of these hundreds of parliamentarians jumping up and clapping their hands, again and again and again and again, with the Leader graciously acknowledging with a movement of his hand, was reminiscent of other regimes. Only this time it was not the local dictator who compelled this adulation, but a foreign one.
      The most depressing part of it was that there was not a single lawmaker – Republican or Democrat – who dared to resist. When I was a 9 year old boy in Germany, I dared to leave my right arm hanging by my side when all my schoolmates raised theirs in the Nazi salute and sang Hitler’s anthem. Is there no one in Washington DC who has that simple courage? Is it really Washington IOT – Israel Occupied Territory – as the anti-Semites assert? …


  9. LOL… this article makes me smile … and shows how wrong and misguided this writer is about Israel.

    Israel cannot power beyond beyond Gaza and that is a fact and what this writer is talking about far flung Iran and Turkey?

    Air planes cannot project power. Land forces do and Israel is such a tiny little force compared to modern day fighters like Hezbollah. …and another stupid comments about using drones .. these can easily be shot down with manpads and aided by tracking radars.

    Remember, they are not fighting rag tags Talibans who depended on no major power with modern day weapons. They are fighting modern day armies and equipments!

    Come back to earth … ..dont dream.

  10. Israel’s move seems like a good one actually. It has the basin before it and Cyprus agrees. Turkey can do nothing about it. Israel wins.

    … 😉 We’ll come back to this one on a rainy day.

  11. Bibi: First We’ll Take Tehran, Then We’ll Take Istanbul
    If Bibi is serious about that then that really leaves Turkey with one option and that is join the SCO and take steps to defeat Israeli aggression in all its forms. Unfortunate perhaps but it might be nessesary.
    Being a NATO country might not be enough if other NATO countries won’t help Turkey because Israel effectively controls them.

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