What was the last event in world history you can recall being a “crime against the Jewish people?” If you answered, “the Holocaust” you win all the money Elie Wiesel lost with Wall Street’s Jewish Ponzi-schemer, Bernie Madoff. Here’s how Haaretz reports Wiesel’s latest eruption against the UN Gaza report:
Wiesel blasted Judge Richard Goldstone, saying his report on the Israeli offensive in Gaza was “a crime against the Jewish people.”
Yes, even a Nobel laureate and Holocaust survivor is not above invoking the Holocaust in order to smear the Goldstone Report. Next thing you know, they’ll accuse Goldstone of drinking the blood of Jewish babies…oh wait, they’ve already done that!
And note that Wiesel accuses Goldstone not of a crime against Israel, but of a crime against the entire Jewish people! What narischkeit! And this is precisely the narrative the Bibi Netanyahu uses in smearing Iran: they want to destroy not just Israel, but all of the Jewish people. People, get off it. Stop distorting the record. Stop mangling Jewish history for partisan political goals.
Wiesel should be absolutely ashamed of himself. He of all people should know that the Holocuast is a sui generis event. It should never be cheapened as he has done with this vile, implicit comparison of Goldstone to the worst tragedy to ever befall the Jewish people. Does this Nobel laureate and moral conscience of the Jewish people need lessons on such things? No.
I’m sorry to say that Wiesel has fallen from the high pedestal on which Jews have placed him. He no longer wears a crown or moral righteousness. Frankly, I’m astonished that 40 other Nobel laureates are joining him in denouncing Ahmadinejad in full page ads in the N.Y. Times. What they neglect to realize (or perhaps they do) is that their propaganda will be used by those in Israel and elsewhere who wish to see war with Iran. Is that something this moral beacon is willing to have weighing on his conscience? Or does he believe that any perceived danger to Israel, no matter how ephemeral, deserves the type of military assault that his friends in Israeli high places would like to offer?
Returning to Goldstone, apparently the titans of the Jewish world are quaking in their boots about the Goldstone Report and the jeopardy in which it places Israel. I never would’ve thought this possible as recently as six months ago…that Israel’s generals and politicians might actually face culpability for their crimes against the Palestinian people.
And when you read a passage like this concerning the assassination in Dubai of a Hamas arms merchant, then you know the narrative leads only one direction:
The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, will be at the top of Dubai’s wanted list if the Israeli foreign intelligence service Mossad is proven to be behind the killing of a senior Hamas official, the Dubai Police chief said yesterday.
Lt Gen Dahi Khalfan Tamim told The National that “Benjamin Netanyahu, the Israeli prime minister, will be the first to be wanted for justice as he would have been the one who signed the decision to kill [Mahmoud] al Mabhouh in Dubai. We will issue an arrest warrant against him.”
Those of you with good memories will remember that Bibi Netanyahu, when he was last prime minister, approved the assassination of Khaled Meshal in Jordan. The method was quite similar to the way in which Mahmoud al Mabhouh was killed. In the former case, a team of Mossad agents accosted Meshal in the street and injected his ear with a slow-acting poison. On his death, it would’ve appeared he had had a heart attack, which was precisely the same outcome in Dubai. The only problem with the Meshal murder was the agents were captured, a major international row ensued, and Bibi was forced to provide an antidote or risk his spies facing trial and incarceration in Jordan. And we all know how this little melodrama turned out–Meshal now runs Hamas’ government in exile and is one of Israel’s biggest nightmares.
In Dubai, they chose a better place to kill al Mabouh, in the privacy of his hotel room, so the poison could do its work and no one would be the wiser. By the time the Dubai authorities discovered the poison in the victim’s system, they were long gone. Another Mosad success…but not so fast.
If Israel did kill al Mabouh, it shows Bibi thinks he’s playing by the old rules: I’ll git ya if I can by hook or by crook; whatever it takes. Those rules don’t work anymore as the Goldstone Report has shown regarding the Gaza War. The new rules for Israel are: if you play by the old rules we’re (the world community) gonna git ya, and not the other way around. In other words, the days when Israel could get away with virtually anything are rapidly coming to a close. There will be a price for misbehavior. The worse the conduct the higher the price. Wouldn’t it be ironic if Bibi’s order to kill a mid-level Hamas operative in a Dubai hotel room was the decision that brought him to the Hague?
And if, as Hamas claimed, the Mosad agents entered Dubai in the retinue of Israeli minister Uzi Landau, we could have two Israeli pols in the docket. Amazing that Israeli politicians like Landau seem to think that they too are impregnable.
And yes, my dear right-wing readers (there are a few of you), if Israel did not assassinate al-Mabouh, it’s still a good thing for Dubai’s police chief to warn an Israeli prime minister that the ways of the past are over and that Impunity is no longer. The next time they do plan such an assassination they ought to have in the front of their mind the fact that some day they may face justice for the act they contemplate.
it has long been obvious that Wiesel is a fantical Zionist williing to excuse any Israeli atrocity.
So why the surpise about his denouncing the Goldstone report?
Wiesel is also a Nakba denier–you can find his denialism on display about halfway down in this 2001 NYT column. And by that time we already knew enough about the 1948 expulsions to make Wiesel’s column inexcusable–
link
First: al Mabhouh had a role in the capture and execution of two young Israelis in 1989. The world is better off without him.
Second: there is not one shred of evidence against Israel. You say he was poisoned; that’s also not proven. Other accounts say he was strangled or electrocuted. In a recent account, Hamas itself blamed “agents of an Arab government” for al Mabhouh’s demise.
Third: stop throwing around the word “Jewish” the way you do. Who cares of Madoff was Jewish? And explain how it’s the “Jews” who placed Wiesel on a pedestal. He’s a respected Nobel prize winner.
The world is better off without a lot of people, Jacob, including some in the IDF–should they all be murdered in their beds?
Wow, way to deflect the topic. When did I ever say anything about the IDF?
Way to avoid answering the question. I brought up the IDF to point out that the category of “people the world would be better off without” includes some people you may find more ideologically sympathetic than al-Mabhouh.
OK. You bring me the names or faces of an IDF soldier or two who kidnapped two people in separate incidents, shot them in the head, and buried them. Then we’ll talk.
How about the IAF pilot who dropped a multi ton bomb on a Gaza apt. building toppling it & killing women & children (18 in all) in order to kill a single Palestinian militant. Could the bodies being buried in the rubble count as “burying them” & satisfy yr conditions?
Jacob, you’re entering deep waters in a leaky boat. I suggest you turn back.
Jacob,
You sure you want to go there? People here can give you countless examples.
Have you ever heard of due process? It’s what civilized countries employ when dealing with suspected criminals.
Oh, you mean the “due process” they have in Dubai and Syria? Get real.
actually, maybe at least due process like they have in Israel. Not for the perpetrators of the rachel currie murder and anderson’s maiming but for the settler thugs caught in the act of killing or beating up palestinians. At least israeli due process include house arrest for arsonists. that’s a start.
I’m not here shilling for Israel. I’m just saying that this terrorist wasn’t about to be prosecuted for his crimes by any of the region’s backward governments. No one knows if this was the Mossad or not. If it was, the message was clear: mess with us, we mess with you.
This is racist & also a violation of my comment rules. Read them. If you violate the rules again your privileges will be restricted.
Does the fact that Dubai & Syria have inferior systems of justice justify Israel murdering people w/o trial? Or do you wish to lose the moniker, “only democracy in the MIddle East?”
If the world is better off without mabhoud, then by the same token it is also beter off without bibi and most certainly without criminal junta figures like ashkenazi and barak. It is better off without the likes of the killer of rabin and also without the pilot who murdered an entire palestinian family. Why should one spend his life in luxury jail and the other run around between talk shows? Those are just a few known murderers, using your own reasoning. Now, if the arabs had an outfit like mossad, would they not be right to use the same tactics you advocate? what do we call such acts – extra-judicial assassinations – or mafia-style wasting of one’s opponents?
BTW, jacob, what of the murder of the Iranian scientist recently, who apparently was not even a nuclear scientist, but more like a theoretical particle physicist? and a sympathizer with the reformists, no less. All indications point again to mossad. How charming….
I wonder who’s next on their list – goldstone perhaps? oops, I forgot – jewish “mosers” do not need to be “eliminated” physically. They just need to be ex-communicated like they did to Spinoza – the greatest jewish philosopher ever (IMO), and to tony judt.
It’s good that the world is waking up – as Richard points out. Once mafia tactics are acceptable (as they seem to be to israel) it will be difficult not to be regarded as mafiosi. Far from admiration and accolades, murders like this will only raise the ghosts of count bernadotte – a peace maker murdered by jewish zealots – an act that to this day is admired – and justified in Israel – and only there. darn, had the good count been jewish, we’d all be still reading the books he would have surely written in grand tribal exile.
Oh, give me a break. It’s not Bibi or Barak or even Lieberman you hate, it’s Israel itself. Bibi’s not the same man he was ten years ago: he has repeatedly stated he is willing and ready to come to the table without preconditions (both with the Palestinians and the Syrians). He cares about his legacy and, as the leader of a strong coalition, he will take difficult steps for peace (ie evacuating the Golan). If only there was someone to talk to on the other side.
And please, this isn’t a death penalty discussion. If it were, I’d agree with you that Rabin’s murderer should be dead. And what is your feeling about Samir Kuntar, the guy who smashed the little girl’s head in in Nahariya, shot her father, got married in Israeli prison, got a university degree in Israeli prison, and was released in a prisoner “exchange”–for a couple of corpses–in 2008?
And you know what about the Mossad? Unlike the Arabs, they don’t go after civilians. They go after the real bad guys. The Arabs probably wish they had an organization that good. But they’re too busy fighting with each other to devote enough energy to killing all the Jews.
Wow, a Bibi fan on Richard’s blog. This is going to be interesting. You don’t even realize how weak Netanyahu’s coalition actually is. http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1138141.html
And your remark about the Arabs – which Arabs are fighting with each other these days? And can you explain your remark about them not devoting “enough energy to killing all the Jews”?
I think you were staring out the window thru most of your hasbara lessons, my dear.
Sorry, but THIS IS a death penalty discussion. To be specific: it’s death penalty without due process discussion. Which is why I brought in the mafia, because that’s what mafia justice is: execute first, then pass sentence, then wring hands. I object to flaunting of law and justice done in the name of US imperialism ( whether it’s death by drone, or by n”special forces”). And I most certainly object when done by Israel. It is wrong because it serves no good purpose other than revenge. And it compromises the executioners as well as their apologists. By definition, Israelis care very little about “collateral damage” and US cares little about wedding parties shot to high heaven. Being an executioner means you don’t question what you do – simply assume it’s the ‘right’ thing to do – just as you have justified. This diminishes you as a person and as a citizen of the west.
You just did apologize for murderers (mossad) who showed zero regard for ‘citizens” in the past. That makes you on par with suicide bombers of pizzerias – after all, if there was one soldier sitting there who was deemed an “enemy combatant” or just “enemy killer” then presumably it’s alright to blow up the entire place. In the end it’s about the magnitude of the collateral damage, right? and if that’s the case, then barak, livni and olmert are fair game for retaliation, no? how many innocent men, women and children killed in gaza? 1000? 900? lots more than all the suicide bombers killed combined.
Another example: by your own reasoning the bomber of the cia agents in afganistan was a truly heroic individual – note that no civilians were killed – only agents who were themselves responsible for countless innocent deaths.
As I said above: without respect for law and due process, what we have is mafia-style justice. If you agree with it for your side, then you agree with it for your adversaries and anyone else.
Hope you enjoy gang warfare because that’s what you are advocating. I am merely holding up the case for consistency.
The targeted killing of Sheikh Yassin also took out nine bystanders. Sheikh Yassin never personally killed anyone, yet he was deemed so dangerous that he was killed by a rocket as he was leaving a mosque after prayers. A nearly blind quadriplegic, and also elderly, he could have been apprehended (as he was on other prior occasions) and put on trial, but apparently the government of Israel thought better of it, and whacked him in the same manner as a mafioso would a don in a rival crime family.
This is a prime example of the barbarity of “extrajudicial” acts, the kind of thing a rogue state would commit.
“And you know what about the Mossad? Unlike the Arabs, they don’t go after civilians.”
Funniest line I read today!
He has done nothing that would give his potential peace partners (particularly the Palestinians) any reason to believe that he is actually willing to make peace and accept a Palestinian state in the West Bank and Gaza. In particular, he continues to support settlements, particularly East Jerusalem settlements, which is akin to one nation saying it wants peace with another – while busily grabbing as much land as possible from that second nation before any type of treaty comes through preventing it. The other nation (or in real life, the Palestinians) are right to point out that negotiations merely come across as diversions on the part of Bibi in such a situation, an attempt to stall time while he continues the agenda of invading Palestinian land.
Perhaps you should ask the Israeli government, since they agreed to the trade.
Is that their justification for the Lillehammer Affair? And before you point out that that was a mistake, remember that whether or not it was their target, they still went after a civilian and his family in a foreign country.
I’ll tell you what I hate. I hate cant, hypocrisy, lying, distortion, putting words in the mouths of others that they haven’t spoken themselves. So if you want to continue doing these sorts of things yr shelf life here will be quite short.
You might want to rethink that. The Mossad killed a Palestinian waiter thinking he was a Munich terror suspect (he wasn’t). The targeted assassinations by the Shin Bet also killed significant numbers of civlians (collateral damage for you). And why restrict this to the Mossad, let’s include yr friends in the IDF who kill a significant percentage of civilians in virtually every operation they mount incl. the Gaza war.
An ill wind blew you in here. You are about as lame as they come & don’t know what the hell you’re talking about.
I’m tired of yr laziness, racism & general insufferableness. You’re done.
That’s why there are courts my friend. If Israel wants to be judge, jury & executioner w/o any trial then it will pay the price eventually before the ICC. This bullcrap won’t go on any longer.
Ah, yes the “not one single shred of evidence against Israel” routine. We know it well. The fact that he was poisoned has been reported in every major article about the killing. He was provided a drug that would emulate a heart attack & so delay detection of the crime & allow the murderers to exit the country.
I’ll make a deal w. you. You stop telling me what to do & butt out of my editorial decisions & I’ll do the same for you. You believe that Jews haven’t placed Wiesel on a pedestal? Ever since he published Night he’s been the vaunted Jewish moral conscience. You sound like you’re too young to remember this, but beginning in the late 1960s the Soviet Jewry movement & Holocaust awareness were his issues & he was idolized by the American Jewish community for those concerns. This was all BEFORE he won the Nobel.
And DO NOT monopolize the discourse. I do not take kindly to new commenters esp. w. views like yours publishing 10 comments in a single day. This isn’t a grandstanding or debating society in which you score pts for yr side at the expense of the other side. If that’s what you’re interested in you may go elsewhere.
I’m sure if I were a new commenter publishing 10 comments in a single day saying how evil Israel and the Jooooos are, you wouldn’t have such a big problem.
Look, Jacob, go read a few books on the conflict, maybe even some written, by, gasp, Palestinians. You don’t know very much, and we’re tired of knocking you around.
What about giving a serious and thoughtful reply to my post, Jacob? Surely your number of posts does not really concern you, seeing that you devoted your present post to well…nothing.
The rule is there for all. The fact that you’ve already made up yr mind w/o having any experience of how this blog is moderated indicates bad faith on yr part.
There have been many cases where Israeli soldiers (and sometimes also settlers) killed innocent civilians, often children. These people have hardly ever been prosecuted, and if they were, they were often let off with a slap on the wrist.
Palestinians have done the same. In their case however, they have often been wiped out (together with their families) in so-called ‘targeted killings’. When you visit the Haaretz website, you will see advertisements turn up on the side, glorifying the units that perform these extra-judicial killings. I find this shocking.
Extra-judicial killings should be out of bounds anyway, but ESPECIALLY if you do not bring to justice people who have done similar things on own side.
Goldstone????? Why single out the Goldstone Report when it is so obvious that Israel has no high horse to fall from. Its entire history is that of inflicting misery and persecution upon the Palestinian people. Fascinating, the level of denial and the extent of the rationalization I see coming from famous Zionists, not-so-famous Zionists, and the Israeli government, and also in many instances from liberal, “progressive” Jews. Where the hell have you people been since 1948? Pull your heads out of wherever you’ve been hiding them, and look at reality.
Jacob,
Ariel Sharon was responsible for the Kibiya massacre. Should he be murdered in his bed?
Given the huge power wielded by Zionists in the US can anyone be surprised that our “leaders” takes take their cue from Israel on these matters and now also are engaged in large scale “targeted killlings (murder) of people deemed to be “militants.
Can anyone doubt that these tactics will be applied right here at home and not just against Moslem “militants” if serious unrest ever breaks out in the US. The FBI/Police vendetta agaisnt the Black Panthers during the 1960s whuch saw many of their leaders killed is a grim warning in this regard.
Glenn Greenwald has some interesting things to say”
http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/?source=rss&aim=/opinion/greenwald/
I’m not going to get into the rather paranoid wonderings of whether or not “these tactics will be applied right here at home and not just against “moslem” militants” – yeesh, you mean it’s not so bad if the government just goes after MUSLIMS and leaves “real” Americans alone? But on the other hand, by your statement regarding the Black Panthers you are asserting that they already have been applied in the US.
In any event, the question is whether or not it is legal, ethical or moral to blow off due process and become judge, jury and executioner. I say it is not. It is becoming a world where we are sinking lower and lower towards becoming the very same kind of people we call our enemies.
Actually, I confess i had Glenn’s article in mind when I made my comment above. He made the case for the rule of law better than I could, but I have been working on a little comparison with mafia style justice for some time now. Need just a few more spices – maybe jacob can be the inspiration I needed.
Thanks for referencing, mary.
I read the article yesterday and it stuck in my mind, as well as something else i read somewhere about how Obama can order the killing of an American citizen on foreign soil if he believes the person is a terrorist.
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I beg to differ. Goldstone did not denigrate Jews. He told the truth about the Israeli government and its armed forces. There is a huge difference.
My point in warning that allowing government officials to order the assasination of people at their pleasure is extremely dangerous and that folks who think this will only apply to “evil” Moslem “militants” are extremely naive. As John Dunne said many years ago “ask not for whom the bell tolls it tolls for thee”.
That’s John Donne, friend. Get literate.
I’m always amused by your spin Richard. Let me enlighten you to a few facts.
1 Netanyahu, Israel etc. is never going before the ICJ.
2 There is not a shred of evidence linking Israel to the killing in Dubai. Hamas which should know states it was not Israel but other Arabs.
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1146944.html
3 Calling most of the regions governments backward is not racist. It’s a fact.
Your “rules” are your method of weeding out those who oppose your views.
And you know this how? By being clairvoyant? An ICJ judge? Prosecutor? International law expert? Propagandist? Ah, the last one hit the mark didn’t it?
You mean other than stories in all the world media including Haaretz which DO intimate a link to the Mossad, including statements by the authorities in Dubai itself? One statement was released by Hamas saying there MIGHT have been other suspects than Israel. MIGHT. An earlier Hamas statement blamed Israel. Another Dubai statement stated Bibi would be charged if Israel was responsible.
Israel itself is backward compared to true western democracies, not least because it has racist defenders like you.
Then why is it that there are many who oppose my views who manage to avoid racial stereotyping of the sort you lapsed into? Your future comments, if any, will be moderated.