36 thoughts on “On 2nd Anniversary in Israeli Prison, Abusisi Charges Mossad Spirited Him from Ukraine in Coffin – Tikun Olam תיקון עולם إصلاح العالم
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  1. ‘[After arrival in Israel] Abu Sisi was transferred to “Petah Tikva,” an Israeli detention center’

    LOL. I think the author meant that Abu-Sisi was transferred to the “Petah Tikva Detention Center”. His phrasing makes it sound that the city Petah Tikva is in itself a detention center, which is perhaps too harsh a description of this admittedly sleepy city.

    1. Dachau is/was a sleepy small town in Southern Bavaria. Is what we “mean” using the name Dachau a perhaps too harsh “description” of this admittedly sleepy city. In both towns were (are in Petah Tikva) political prisoners.

      PS. Should I use LOL in this context like you do?

      1. You’re on the edge of losing, according to Goodwin’s law, although something tells me you don’t care about that.

        “In both towns were (are in Petah Tikva) political prisoners. ”
        No. Israel does not have “political” prisoners. Name a single prisoner who is arrested in Israel for his “politics”.
        Hint: Dirar Abu-Sisi is not a political prisoner. He was likely arrested due to his involvement with developing rocket technology for Hamas.

        1. (Put aside the Dachau comparison)

          There are plenty of Palestinian political prisoners (Khader Adnan for one). Unproven terror-involvement claims are part of a much-practised procedure which guarantees a court approval to the detention of (non-Jewish) “suspects”.

          1. Khader Adnan has long ties with Islamic Jihad. At one point, he was arrested by the Palestinian Authority itself for such charges.

            I understand that you have an inclination to automatically doubt the claims of Israel’s security forces, but doubt alone is not sufficient proof to the claim that Adnan was arrested on a political basis, especially given his proven terrorist background.

            “which guarantees a court approval to the detention of (non-Jewish) “suspects”.”
            This simply isn’t true. There are many Jews who are under administrative arrest, which is a specialized tool dealing with terrorists. It is certainly not applied to “Arabs only”. Here’s one such example (In Hebrew)
            http://www.haaretz.co.il/misc/1.1189648

          2. You voted my ass, you hasbarist. Israeli intelligence services CLAIM he has ties to IJ. What is the evidence? He & his family claim he has no political ties.

            Anyway, by agreeing to release him Israel has tacitly conceded it has no evidence proving he had engaged in an illegal act. Do you have any? We have every reason to doubt the security forces. It is the onus of the State to rove his guilt, not for us to prove he’s innocent.

            There’s are hundreds, if not thousands of Palestinians held without charges or trial and almost no Jews.

            You have really angered me with yr claim you voted Meretz. I think you’re a liar & I detest liars. I put you on notice that the next lie you offer may be yr last here.

          3. I thought his claim of voting Meretz was disreputable, so guess we’re even. If it were the first time such a commenter attempted to wrap himself in a leftist flag I would be less indignant, but others have done similar things here. Note after I challenged him he never repeated his claim or defended it.

        2. Using LOL and trying turn the discussion from the detention center to a sleepy town shows bad taste. The Dachau analogy was made in that context. People could also begin to mention of the sleepy town which Dachau is and was in the 30’s when others mean to speak about the concentration camp of Dachau. For Palestinians Israeli detention centers and concentration camps ARE no joke like German camps WERE no joke for Jews.

          He was likely arrested due to his involvement with developing rocket technology for Hamas . If so were is his public trial with the evidence, surely not a complicated matter to prove if there is the evidence. If you claim that Israel has no political prisoners then explain why those hundreds and thousands of Palestinians held are in Israeli Jewish prisons and concentration camps. A tiny percent of the prisoners are there for direct militant resistance using real weapons (not stones). Most of them are jailed simply because they belong to some Palestinian organizations, were in the wrong place (for example wall demonstrations), have face a Jewish soldier did not like and many without no legal process (administrative detention).
          http://www.btselem.org/statistics/detainees_and_prisoners

          Dachau concentration camp was established mainly for political prisoners. In Dachau they held communists, social democrats, priests and others who the regime considered as enemies. During its existence, 12 years, two thirds were political prisoners. We should remember what that camp was in the beginning.

          When one watches the Israeli prison system from the viewpoint of Palestinians or an outsider (mostly non-Jews) you should understand that their viewpoint of the system is completely different of that how the members of the ruling religion do see the prison system which is run by them. It is clear that Palestinians do not see that Israeli prison system as a legitimate and honest, for them it is dishonest, torturing and humiliating system.

          In the camps of Germany Jews were the VICTIMS. In Israeli camps Jews are the GUARDS and TORTURERS, not the victims. In 2008 Israeli Prison Service had 25,000 prisoners, 60 percent of them for criminal offences and 40% for security offences. 40% of 25 thousand is 10,000. Hmmm …

        3. It certainly does have political prisoners and many peace activist Jews arrested for purely political beliefs having nothing to do with violence or illegality. Happens all the time at Sheikh Jarrah protests, Bilin, etc. Right wing Jewish terrorists who actually kill people are almost never arrested, let alone charged, convicted or jailed. The latest price tag attacks testify to that.

        4. The irony is that Abusisi isn’t involved in politics at all, but ISRAEL made him a political prisoner by arresting him on trumped up charges. He has no engineering training in missile technology as was proven by a reporter for the Kiev Post who profiled him last month & disproved every claim by Israel’s security services about his so called terror training in Ukraine.

          You’re a shill for Israeli security services. I suppose their may be Shabakniks & their camp followers who vote Meretz, but unlikely.

        5. “You voted my ass, you hasbarist”
          ” I think you’re a liar & I detest liar”

          I really don’t know what to say. Your level of agression speaks for itself. You keep making this very personal and hateful. You should be ashamed of yourself.

          1. U should be ashamed of yrself. You haven’t voiced a single idea or political principle anyone in Meretz would agree with. So either you’re a liar & take us for fools that would be so gullible as to believe. Or you’re telling the truth & had some sort of rightist epiphany that turned you from Meretz into what you are today. And you’re damn straight I detest liars & trolls.

      2. @SimoHurtta,
        How you can reasonably compare Petach Tikva to Dachau is beyond me.
        Why do you feel the need to compare Petach Tikva to Dachau.

        1. Appealing to what you hold valuable. The truth needs no mandate for protection, like “Godwin’s Law”. Only something less than the truth…

          One can be out of line with descriptions or over the top. But in comparing Israeli actions to those of the Nazis within reason, we are not making Nazi actions seem any better or diminishing the tragedy/shame: we are using it to give Israel and its supporters perspective as to its ways and to realize it must do everything to steer clear of espousing such similarities. Nothing is a better example than one that hits home.

          1. I guess we could make more effort to avoid inadvertent Godwin violations.

            Leavenworth is a city in Kansas with 35,000 inhabitants. When someone is “sent to Leavenworth” it is usually assumed “sent to The United States Disciplinary Barracks”, the only maximum security prison of US military. NOBODY uses the “correct term”, so one can explain “sent to Leavernworth, i.e. the maximum security prison of US military”.

        2. Daniel F. I did not compare the prisons of Petach Tikva and Dachau. I protested the usage of the image of a simple sleepy town in order to distract the discussion. If Petach Tikva is seen simply as a sleepy town so then should also Dachau be seen as a such. Both are without doubts towns, which how ever have located a prison/torture center with a bad reputation. Dachau camp today is a museum. Petach Tikva Facility is not.

          Petach Tikva Facility has a terrible reputation, which can easily validated using internet.
          For example see 5 pages of details
          http://www.machsomwatch.org/en/taxonomy/term/360
          and the pdf file on the page
          http://www.hamoked.org/Document.aspx?dID=Documents1308

          Petach Tikva detention center is only one of many. Israel has many detention centers, eight. Pretending that they are civilized institutions where highly educated and moral humanists use civilized discussions to find out the truth is pure propaganda. If Jews were treated in such centers using the methods Jews use in treating Palestinians by Arabs, it would INSTANTLY cause an international wave of sharp condemnation. Israel has practiced this inhuman violent domination in prisons for decades and managed to keep it mostly out of the flash lights. Not anymore.

          The problem is that Israel is only on the start of the path of a total moral collapse and tragic events. How can millions with a different religion be driven from their homes and be forced to ever shrinking areas without using severe violence and a concentration camp system? Invading West Bank to Jews and massive ethnic cleansing will cause a period where the comparisons to that dark German period will be “justified” even to those who now try to deny the present reality and likely future. The “results” Israeli Jews want can’t be created without “breaking the eggs”. When Lieberman mentioned that Israel should bomb Aswan damn even he and other Israeli Jews understand that creating a situation where 110 cubic kilometers water of Lake Nasser storming down the Nile would cause the murder of countless millions. Same with creating more “lebensraum” on the occupied areas. Hundreds of nukes are in the hands of these religious nationalistic nuts running Israel and they are daily expressing their readiness to use extreme violence. Sooner or later the situation will run totally away from control and then we will see events not seen for decades in western countries.

  2. The Abu-Sisi coffin story lacks any sense. You can imagine that the coffin was used to bypass Ukrainian custom agents, hence the chances are that whoever would ever be inside said coffin would be unconscious, in such case he would need to have oxygen supply and monitored. If the Mossad would like to transport an unconscious man, why tell him he will be delivered in a coffin ?
    If the man is conscious inside the coffin, can you imagine the look on the Ukrainian custom agents when they hear pounding coming out of the coffin ?

    Don’t forget that the Ukrainian – according to your own story – cooperated with the Mossad, so there is really no need in all that.

    As for Khader Adnan – the guy is no member of the Mother Theresa order – he’s the spokesperson of the Islamic Jihad in the west bank. He was arrested few times before, including by the Palestinian Authority.

    During the last 10 years, the Islamic Jihad was responsible for killing 134 and wounding 880 mostly civilians.

    it would be nice if you’ll bring the entire story to your audience.

    1. They moved Rabbi Yohanan ben Zakkai out of Jerusalem in a coffin right under the Romans’ noses without killing him. I guess it can be done with the right skills, which you appear unable to envision.

      1. You are rejuvenating the Jewish heritage.

        First Jews in the State of Israel (now and then) are / were not buried in a coffin.
        Second Rabbi YBZ, was trying to escape out of the city of Jerusalem and played dead, The story tells us that the guards wanted to stab the body (from which you can understand that he wasn’t in a coffin) to verify that he was dead.

        So there is really no base for comparison.

      2. I don’t think they had the same kind of x-ray and other security equipment in Roman times that they have today, so moving someone out in a coffin would probably be a lot easier then.

    1. Going to be released on 17th April after an agreement was brokered that there would not be a further extention of the detention.

      1. Shmuel i don’t think you are right.
        according to what i read the Administrative detention will not be extended, but if the state gathered enough and will decide to prosecute him, he will remain in prison.

  3. Adnan was protesting his May 1 release date. Waaahh! Now he’ll be released sooner and can return to his activism for Islamic Jihad.

    1. His detention was extended once before & no doubt would’ve been extended again. Change yr name to an Arabic sounding one & yr birthplace to Palestine & let’s see how quickly you’re released.

  4. overlook: “Hint: Dirar Abu-Sisi is not a political prisoner. He was likely arrested due to his involvement with developing rocket technology for Hamas.”

    What does it mean “likely”? I guess “there is a possibility that his indictment is not a pure poppycock”, because this is roughly what it says, plus organizing some kind of “Terrorist Academy of Technology” etc.

    One problem is that his “arrest” was a highly illegal procedure, kidnapping in a foreign country. Apparently, Ukrainians, Jordanians etc. were duly bribed and Israel got away with it with only minuscule diplomatic trouble. Still illegal, though.

    A major problem is that the factual claims in the indictments that could be check happened to be false. Namely, he never studied rocket science in Ukraine, but electrical engineering, running power stations. At this was his occupation. The parts of the indictment that cannot be easily checked, his alleged activity in Hamas rocket program, seem extremely dubious. Rockets made in Gaza seem to be worthless crap from military point of view. More recently, there were cases of somewhat better rockets being used, all attributed to smuggling. If you think about it, the alleged scheme of developing rocket production in Gaza, with exteme difficulties in hiding the facility, smuggling the components etc. simply makes no sense. It would be 100 times easier to organize the production in a safe location, say, Sudan, and smuggling the rockets, perhaps in pieces for assembly. And definitely it would make no sense to DESIGN rockets in Gaza, because that requires testing.

    So the indictment consists of a false part and preposterous part. There were also some statements by Ehud Barak that were less illogical, but most probably false (that Abu Sisi was familar with the location where Gilad was in captivity).

    How Mossad could arrive at such wrong conclusion can only be speculated. Some role belongs to “ever reliable” secret informers. Employment of idiots in intelligence agency is neither illegal nor immoral.

    However, by now the innocence of Abu Sisi is quite clear, one cannot even pin “membership in illegal organization” on him. Well, with “secret evidence” this is simplicity itself, but slim picking but “we” were promised a fascinating show trial.

    The news about the cruel conditions and bad health of Abu Sisi suggest that authorities want him to die, basically, they want to bury their mistake. Abu Sisi is simply a manager of a power station who had enough of that job and emigrated/fled to Ukraine. He is not even a political prisoner in normal sense of the word, just a patsy of an inhuman system.

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