“Islamic reformer” who detests Islam? Hardly. And note that ominous terrorist peering out at you from behind his kafiiyeh.Looks like the evangelical Arab haters have another Muslim convert they’re displaying on their wall like those animal heads you see in hunters’ trophy rooms. He’s Tawfiq Hamid. The reason I know about this is that after exposing another such former Muslim turned Islam-hater, Walid Shoebat, I seem to have gotten on his mailing list. I’m only too happy to receive their mailings and let my readers know about the numbskull antics of such pro-Israel evangelicals. Their latest prize is Dr. Hamid who they’re parading before the American public for the first time in an appearance at Georgetown University next month (don’t really want to publicize this ‘wonder’ so I won’t give any more particulars, though if you wish to see Greystoke in DC e mail me and I can give you further information).
Here’s what Shoebat’s website tells you about Hamid:
Born in Egypt to a secular Muslim family. At the age of 16 young Hamid started to search for answers to the universal questions about creation and life’s meaning.
Later on, Tawfik started to read the bible as an attempt to criticise it in the ongoing religious debates between Muslims and Christians, but ended up studying the Bible with increased vigour and genuine interest.
If you compare that last paragraph to Shoebat’s own biography at the same site you have to wonder whether a single person is writing their ad copy:
Walid studied the Tanach (Jewish Bible) in a challenge to convert his wife to Islam. Six months later, after intense study, Walid realized that everything he had been taught about Jews was a lie. Convinced he was on the side of evil, he became an advocate for his former enemy.
Hamid’s story continues:
Tawfik Hamid joined the Islamic Group GI in Egypt in Medical School. It was the same group that produced Alzawaherri ( the number 2 person of Al Qaeda) and Tawfik used to pray regularly with him.
In just a few months Tawfik as he puts it “discovered the evil of these groups” and developed his own Islamic sect that was peaceful and promoted love to every human being irrespective of his or her religion. He started to preach in Mosques to promote his message of peace and as a result became a target of many Islamic fanatics who threatened his life.
Tawfik says “The powers of darkness were overwhelming and I was forced to emigrate with my family to the West seeking freedom.”
“I am willing to speak out against Islamic Fundamentalism that prevails in the world today.”
Chuck Johnson, Roger Simon and the Pajamas Media crowd are going to be wetting their pants over this guy if he isn’t plastered all over their blogs already. And Aussie Dave can’t be far behind.
Shoebat speakers bureau: is ‘Ibrahim Abdullah’ a transgendered “outspoken Arab” or an example of careless image placement?To that last statement we should add that he’s willing to “speak out” to the tune of $13,500 a pop (or so says Shoebat’s website). It appears they’re looking for universities with a rich speaker budget who’ll spring for such a “novelty.” If any student activities director is reading this post, you should know that if you invite this dude you’re inviting a poster boy for evangelical Christianity and indirectly promoting anti-Arab propaganda. It looks like Georgetown has ponied up some serious dough for this guy.
Here are some of the stellar media outlets Hamid and the other Arab quislings have used to promote their agenda: Frontpagemagazine.com (can’t bring myself to provide a link to this shmatteh), O’Reilly Factor (video), Dennis Prager (audio), Jerusalem Post, Irish Post, Irish Radio. I get the first four as they’re known right-wingers but what about the Irish media. Don’t those folks get about in the world enough to see through these charlatans?
And since we’re on the subject of Irish media, let’s provide some passages from a Hamid interview on the Orla Barry radio show (audio stream courtesy Shoebat.com). One question you should keep in mind as you read this is–how can a man who grew up secular with little or no experience of spirituality until he was 16 (note he doesn’t even say that he practiced Islam after age 16) and who later rejected Islam in medical school claim to know so much about Islam? What did he learn and when did he learn it?
Hamid: When I joined the medical school, I met with some people from the Jemmah Islamiya or the Islamic Group who talked to me about religion and how Islam should dominate the world. But it just takes you gradually via a brainwashing mechanism that made me at the end really a very bad person in my soul. And I then started to be against all of this. During this period I was with Dr. Al-Zawahiri in the same Islamic group in the medical school, Jemmah Islamiya. Then I thought I am becoming a very bad person and my soul is becoming very evil. So I started to change my thoughts and create a new sect or new way of thinking in Islam. But unfortunately, the vast majority of Muslims were against any peaceful understanding. And they prefer this violent traditional teaching of Islam.
Barry: In what way were you being brainwashed, what were you being told?
Hamid: For example, if you are an ordinary Muslim in the traditional Islamic teaching in the books and in the mosques, they teach you that you have to beat your son to force him to pray when he is 7. And if you are a husband you have to beat your wife to discipline her according to the traditional Islamic teaching. So these are some factors that create elements of violence…and also it teaches you to hate non-Muslims, Christians and Jews. Traditionally, Muslims invaded other people’s land to force them on Islam [sic] either to become Muslims or pay money for them or to be killed. These were the three options for non-Muslims.
Barry: What were you actually told about Christians and Jews and other religions?
Hamid: What they teach in the mosque, for example, is that Jews are the sons of pigs and monkeys. This is traditional teaching in most of the mosques and the classical teachings in most of the books. And about the Christians, this is what they taught us–they are infidels who will go to Hell and will be tortured forever. And they describe to you the way of torturing these Christians. This just makes you as a Muslim feel bad. These people have no soul. They are not human beings. And it’s part of the process of justifying killing them [Jews and Christians]. If God Himself is against them to this degree and they are infidels who will be tortured, why should Muslims care about them and care for their lives?
…There are different degrees of evil [within Islam]. Jemaah Islamiya represents the active evil or active terrorists let us call them who are ready to commit violent acts and all such atrocities. But the majority of Muslim are all passive terrorists. They believe in this evil. They support it either by money or emotionally they are not against it. You can see the number of demonstrations against bin Laden was nearly none in the whole Islamic world.
What is especially pernicious about Hamid’s characterization of Islam as all evil and other religions as all good is the ahistoricity of this notion. While Islam has produced some of the most noxious religious radicals of the recent past, history is replete with butchers from a variety of religions who killed for their God. During the Crusades thousands of Jews were killed by as the Crusaders made their way to Jerusalem and a warrior’s salvation. Think of the auto da fe torturing resisting Jews during the Spanish Inquisition. To bring us up to modern times, think of Meir Kahane’s race hatred which inspired a number of his followers in the U.S. and Israel to murder Arabs and even a prime minister. In northern Ireland, the Rev. Ian Paisley thundered against Catholics while his co-religionists murdered them. We’ve got more than enough religious fanatics and blame for them to go around, thank you. Speaking as if Islam is the only or worst representative of such hatred and killing is a historical fallacy.
Barry: Tawfiq, even over the past seven days [the interview was recorded shortly after the July London terror attacks] there have been plenty of comments coming out both here [in Ireland] and particularly in London and particularly in the UK. And they’re absolutely condemning what happened in London last week.
Hamid: Because Muslims are under pressure now and they are in a weak position they have a system to protect themselves and they are ready to do anything. So they just say to you, “we condemn this.” But they’re [in] their private talks–I personally haven’t seen any practicing Muslim who was against the attacks on September 11th or against bin Laden. I have seen them praying for bin Laden.
Barry: I’m sure we’re going to get plenty of calls from Muslims that do not agree with you. [Here she returns to Jemaah Islamiya] At what point did violence come into play. Were you being encouraged to take action against other religions?
Hamid: There was some attempt by others to drag me into this active form of evil or terrorism–not just to be passive. But I resisted this and this is when I rejected their teaching and I started to separate. Some people tried to drag me to Afghanistan. I was invited to go there but I didn’t. But some people went like Dr. Al-Zawahiri and he continues there.
Barry: Talk to me about Dr. Al-Zawahiri. Did you know him? Did you have any dealing with him?
Hamid: I met with him because he was older than me in the medical school. He used to come to the mosques to give some talks and we used to pray together because the mosque was inside the medical school itself.
He was a very intelligent man. A very sharp mind. He was one of the top in the medical school. If he put his mind in good things, in create things he would’ve been a great person in the world. Unfortunately, the teaching of Islamism itself directs people into a very evil direction.
I need to comment for a second on the denouncement of terror. When the Muslim leaders denounced Salman Rushdie–the author of the book Satanic Verses–or anyone who criticizes Islam from within the Muslim world…that by itself is very powerful. They say he is infidel. He is apostate. If he dies, he should not be buried with Muslims. And this is very frightening for Muslims. And he should not be washed as Muslim before his death and he will be in Hell forever.
But the way of denouncement of attacks on London, you will see them saying that “Islam is against this. We don’t agree with this.” But I want to hear them saying that those who did this are apostates or infidels; or bin Laden is an infidel, as they say about Salman Rushdie or others. They will never say this.
There’s a willful fallacy in Hamid’s argument. Notice he says that no Muslim demonstrated against bin Laden after 9/11. Yet when Barry points out to him Muslims who have done so after the London terror attack, he switches tactics accusing them of being two-faced and not to be trusted. And Hamid is wrong when he claims Muslims will never say bin Laden is an infidel. AmericanMuslim.org lists over 100 separate links to Muslim religious and communal statements denouncing bin Laden and Muslim terror. There are also numerous links to fatwas issued by individual imams. So if you can’t believe him about this what else can’t you believe him about?
Barry: Dennis is asking the question–“why is suicide [bombing] such a feature of Islam?”
Hamid: There could be some ways to understand Islam in a peaceful manner, but unfortunately the current dominant teachings in Islam either in the Middle East or in the western world within the Muslim communities cannot produce anything but such violent creatures. The current classical teaching of Islam which has to change in order to avoid this problem from happening again and again and again.
When you are a child in the Muslim world, the concept of fear of Hell works very well in your mind and makes you fear that if you didn’t obey Allah or the Koran or the prophet Muhammed, you will be tortured in a terrible manner in Hell. They describe exactly what will happen to you in the grave and in Hell and how the fire will burn your skin and your skin will be renewed to be burned again. So this creates a fear for us not to obey the orders of the religion. This is step one of brainwashing. Second step, they tell you to hate. Third step, they tell you to kill and even die for God. If you didn’t do this you will be in Hell forever according to the God they believe.
The issue of torture and hellfire in the mind of the child makes him later on a real susceptible to any order coming from Allah.
Barry: Do your beliefs put you in danger?
Hamid: Yes, I used to speak in mosques to try to change people and make them good people. Humanity should be above every other thing. I read in the Bible and books of philosophy and humanity. And I tried to convey to the Muslim this message. But unfortunately the wave of fundamentalist Islam was supported by countries, by money. Our life was in danger, certainly yes. That is why we couldn’t sustain much more living in the Middle East because it was pretty dangerous.
Actually, if he went around mosques saying the things he says here about Islam why would he be surprised at his reception?
Barry: Are you religious now?
Hamid: Not much. I believe in God, the Creator. If I am asked what is my religion I say I am Muslim by birth, Christian by spirit, Jew by heart and above all I am a human being.
If Hamid is to be believed (and I see no reason why he should be) he has no religion, yet he’s willing to be trotted around the country like a show pony by Christian Zionist groups. You’d have to say something mighty strange is going on. Either the guy converted to evangelical Christianity and is lying; or he likes the money he’s being offered by them.
Barry: Why are you hear to talk to us now?
Hamid: I feel a responsibility to explain this phenomenon of violent Islam to force westerners to understand it and to young Muslim generation so they understand this big game that is happening that is changing the minds of young people and making them just hate life.
Barry then asks him what is the likelihood of further violence in Europe to which he replies that it depends on how the west addresses the problem. If they focus on Islam as the root of the problem then they will be able to stop it. Which begs the question–how should the non-Muslim west “solve the problem” of radical Islam? By extirpating the religion?
Here is one of the cruxes of his right-wing political message:
But if they focus on other causes than the current teachings of Islam like some people try to say it is the Middle East it is the Israel-Palestinian conflict, it is the Iraqi war, but this is not for me logical. Because no one can explain that burning the face of a young girl in Algeria by Islamists, and gang-raping in Pakistan by Islamists, and killing tourist in Egypt has anything to do with the Israeli-Palestinian conflict or the war in Iraq.
I would say that perhaps 10% of what this guy says is valid criticism of Islam. There is no doubt that many of the incidents he mentions did happen. There is no doubt that certain elements within the religion do embrace such hatred of non-Muslims. But the fatal flaw of his argument is that he makes the astounding and preposterous claim that the entire religion embraces these views. Any reasonable person will see through such distortion and overstatement. Anyone who resorts to such exaggeration is not seriously credible.
By the way, expect a ton of nasty comments from Shoebat-Hamid supporters in this post’s thread once word gets out that I’ve “slandered” these good Christian souls. No doubt, Shoebat’s publicist, “100% Jewish” Keith Davies Kalman David Ben Yisrael will be first in line as he was last time I took on Shoebat.
Interesting blog entry…
And one thing to add – in his blaming “gang-raping in Pakistan” by on Islamists:
I recall a piece on NPR about “Honor Killing” in Iraq (I think it was broadcast in late December) they interviewed a man who killed his own under-age neice (the father was unable to do it but supported it) because she was kidnapped and MIGHT have been raped.
He talked about how he KNEW it was against the teachings of Islam. He stated quite explicitly that this was from tribal beliefs that long pre-dated Islam.
I don’t claim to know much about Islam (perhaps “Be” or another visitor here can provide more insight) – and perhaps it’s different in Pakistan than Iraq – but I do believe that it is the same there.
I think much of the wrong in the world that needs to be healed is due to tribalism. Let’s all pray to the day we humans are able to transcend it.
There has been no gang rape by Islamists in Pakistan. He just made it up. Rapes do happen as in almost every other country of the world (with the possible exception of Saudi Arabia) but blaming gang rape on Islam is simply without any basis.
Mr. Siverstein wrote: “Here are some of the stellar media outlets Hamid and the other Arab quislings have used to promote their agenda: Frontpagemagazine.com (can’t bring myself to provide a link to this shmatteh)”
Hey! If you ever have to mention a blog on your site that you find distasteful and do not wish to improve their google ranking there are two things you could do:
1. Create a graphic with the name or address of the blog. This can be read by your visitors but not by search engine spiders.
2. In the URL code add the folllowing: rel=”nofollow” and that tells search engines not to count that link.
I find these techniques very handy against spammers and entities I disagree with.
Another GREAT technique that I use is that I, ahem, simply never mention blogs that I find particularly loathsome.
Thanks, CK, those are excellent tips. I’d seen the “nofollow” tag in link code and heard about it but never quite understood what it did. Now I know.
You’re uh… welcome.
Dear Mr. Silverstein,
You are not correct about Dr. Hamid “lying.” Here is the evidence: http://www.iris.org.il/blog/archives/1042-British-Imam-Praises-London-Bombers.html
Would you mind printing a correction?
Thanks,
Barak
Barak: Either you didn’t read or you didn’t understand this passage:
I claimed that Hamid’s statement that “no Muslim demonstrated against bin Laden after 9/11” was a willful fallacy. And it is. You’ve merely shown that one of the thousands of such Muslim clerics who denounced Islamic terror was a liar (at least according to a Rupert Murdoch rag). But can you disprove the sincerity of the others?
Now, lets get to the link you provide. First, you link to an extreme pro-Israel website, Iris (“dedicated to informing the public about the security needs of the State of Israel”), which advertises “Temple kits” for sale. In other words, this site seems to promote the notion that the Jewish Temple should be restored. Talk about extremist ideology that could ignite a nuclear war (BTW, I’m not the first one who’s noted in these terms the danger of such a radical right-wing notion).
Next, the Iris article links to Murdoch’s Times of London, another hard-right anti-Muslim publication. But let us assume, despite the ideological axes that Murdoch has to grind, that the report that a British imam who initally denounced the London bombings has said to an undercover reporter that the bombings were justified–let’s assume this is true.
What does it prove? That a single imam is a two-faced liar. Does it prove that Islam engages in perfidy? Certainly not. Does it prove that Tawfiq Hamid’s vicious attacks against Islam are justified and accurate? Certainly not.
And now, Barak, could you similarly guarantee for me that none of the settler rabbis has ever rejoiced either publicly or privately in the deaths of Palestinians and that they as a group uniformly denounced the murderous rampage of Baruch Goldstein and other Israeli terrorists who’ve killed Palestinians? Because if you could show me that this was the case, then I’d say that we Jews and supporters of Israel are pure as driven snow when it comes to the charge that we hate Arabs & Palestinians in particular.
I guess I am a bit confused, what is it exactly that you don’t like in the names you mentioned?? Personally I don’t think all Muslims are terrorists or agree with the terrorist ideology. But for the life of me, I can’t understand why you care what this guy has to say. I always welcome comments against radical Islam, no matter who they come from, but always more when it comes from the mouth of Muslims or ex-Muslims, regardless of why they left Islam.
You accuse of these “Ex muslim Zionist” jumping on the gravy train.
Are you not the exact same thing. Being pro Muslim and for the destruction of Israel.
You might say you are pro peace but what you subscribe to is defacto the destruction of Israel.
If ex Muslims are Zionist and you complain about them then you are obviously anti Zionist.
You accuse Mr Hamid of being an “Evangelical” when he is a Muslim Reformer.
You accuse of him of being inaccurate when he is quite accurate. There may have been a few Imams in USA who said 911 but they always qualify thier statements that we Americans are somewhat to blame for the attack with our “policies”
If that is true why did Jews after World war 2 do suicide bombing against Germans. Why do Jews not commit terrorism against the Western powers for killing 6 million. Why have the Arabs on their TV stations adopted the exact same proganda that Nazi Germany adopted.
The bottom line is that you are afraid of the ex Muslims or Muslim reformers who speak against Islam because it interupts your agenda of Jew self hatred and anti Zionist activity.
Arabs and former Muslims who are pro Israel are difficult to refute so you must discredit them with your hatred of Evangelicals. How is it that you have great respect for Muslims of which the culture and religion you know little ornothing of yet you are vitriolic of Christians who support Israel.
Being against abortion or agianst gay marriage is not a bad immoral position. You may not agree and that is fine but your hatred of Christians and support for Islam is hypocritical.
Julian
You’re entitled to yr delusions. But I don’t have to subscribe to them. I am neither pro-Muslim nor anti-Israel. In fact, I am PRO-Israel. Yr interpretation of my views reflects more on yr intolerance & narrow-mindedness than on my real views.
How can he be a “Muslim reformer’ when in the previous sentence you labelled him by implication an “ex Muslim.” How can you leave a religion & then attempt to reform it?
I’ll respond to what I think you’re trying to say since what you actually write is incoherent. Far more than a “few imams” denounced 9/11.
What? What in the world are you talking about?
” In northern (sic) Ireland, the Rev. Ian Paisley thundered against Catholics while his co-religionists murdered them.”
As a Christian, I don’t have any credible views on Islam, which is why I read as many sides as possible. I do think I know that most of the murdering in Northern Ireland was politically motivated and not condoned by either branch of Christianity there. There was certainly no attempt at biblical justification for violence made by either side. (For peace, yes.)
Following on from that, a main point of contention between your interesting article and Hamid’s equally interesting views seems to be the acceptance or otherwise of violent acts committed in the name of a religion. The knowledge I seek is whether or not Islam justifies violent acts against Muslims and/or non-Muslims. If it doesn’t, it is a religion of peace just like Christianity, my own religion. (I can’t speak for Buddhism, Hinduism or another religion as I don’t have any familiarity with them – perhaps others could comment on their teachings on violence.)
Some Christian clergy have agreed that there can be a ‘just war’. Personally, I feel that such theorizing is very open to subjective interpretation and am always alarmed when I hear it used in defense of one aggression or another. There is no Christian teaching that supports it. Christians who go to war or do violence to others do so without God’s support, irrespective of the cause. All Christians know and accept this.
One thing I do see is that outspoken critics of Islam seem to need physical protection. Some of them are mentioned in your article, others can be discovered by searching the media. Similar critics of other religions in general don’t need such protection. Am I misled in some way in this observation?
I disagree. Religion & politics are inextricably intertwined in Northern Ireland. If Protestants and Catholics didn’t think their religion condoned their acts of vengeance they wouldn’t have carried them out.
There is no cut & dried answer to that just as there is no cut & dried answer to that in the Christian & Jewish traditions. There are Muslim sources that condemn violent acts against Muslims & non-Muslims & ones that condone them. It all depends on who you read & who you trust as yr arbiter of Islam. And it’s the same in most of the world’s religions.
Dissenters in every religion and society are reviled for their views. It would be a terrible mistake to believe that Islam has any problems that are diff. or worse than any other religion. Are there intolerant Muslims? Are there violent Muslims? Are there murderous Muslims? Of course. But are there murderous, intolerant, violent Christians & Jews in the world too? Certainly.
Thanks for taking the time to reply. You have some strongly held views – different to mine – that I will not be able to dissuade you from in writing. The Internet Age has become the age of entrenched and opposing viewpoints. We seem to have become polarized in virtually every field of discussion on blogs such as this; no-one seems to have discussable views anymore. This is probably a good subject for a Psychology PhD:-).
As to your replies, it is likely that I didn’t express myself very well as you missed some of my points:
RS – “I disagree. Religion & politics are inextricably intertwined in Northern Ireland. If Protestants and Catholics didn’t think their religion condoned their acts of vengeance they wouldn’t have carried them out.”
Whether the individuals thought this or not doesn’t change the point that Christianity and the Church did not condone it. There isn’t a single instance of a member of the clergy saying that the Gospels approved of the violent acts. The Christians carried out acts of violence despite the lack of support from the Gospels. (It is certainly true that some clergy encouraged and maybe assisted, but that is on their own conscience, not the Church’s.)
RS – “There is no cut & dried answer to that just as there is no cut & dried answer to that in the Christian & Jewish traditions. There are Muslim sources that condemn violent acts against Muslims & non-Muslims & ones that condone them. It all depends on who you read & who you trust as yr arbiter of Islam. And it’s the same in most of the world’s religions.”
That is difficult then. I guess you are saying that Islam can be misappropriated for violent purposes if a Muslim uses the sources that support it, while defenders of Islam as a religion of peace do so using the sources that condemn violence. I have a philosophical problem with that. I can’t talk about most religions as I haven’t studied their scriptures in depth, but I can say Christianity doesn’t condone violence in any of it’s teachings. The reverse, in fact. The Old Testament concept of an eye for an eye is completely absent from Christian scriptures.
RS – “Dissenters in every religion and society are reviled for their views. It would be a terrible mistake to believe that Islam has any problems that are diff. or worse than any other religion. Are there intolerant Muslims? Are there violent Muslims? Are there murderous Muslims? Of course. But are there murderous, intolerant, violent Christians & Jews in the world too? Certainly.”
Being reviled for their views means people are doing the reviling, not their necessarily their religious scriptures. What I am trying to find out is whether Islam supports violence against outspoken critics. I agree that there are violent Christians (just think of the shooting of abortion doctors for example), but the scriptures do not support such violence. They support an anti-abortion stance, but they don’t support killing people who carry out abortion. Homosexuality is another issue where Christians may do violence to others – gays – using the Bible as justification, but they are putting actions to their disapproval that the scriptures condemn. Thou shalt not kill means just that and not Thou shalt not kill or else we will kill you. But I digress, the issue under discussion in this paragraph is outspoken critics and not abortion or gays. I don’t know of any outspoken critic of Christianity in recent times (since the beginning of the 19th century) whose life is or was in danger, supported by the teachings of the Gospels.
I do not want to make a terrible mistake and brand Islam a religion of violence through my own ignorance of it. Your answers haven’t helped me as they avoid the connection – or lack of it – between the motivations of perpetrators of violence and the official teachings of Islam and Christianity. This is what I want to understand with Islam. I understand it with my own religion and thus know that the Christians who do violence, do it on their own initiative and not on the teachings of their Church. You seem to be saying that Muslims, unlike Christians, can choose to either justify or condemn violent actions by choosing the appropriate source.
The bottom line for all this is that to assess a religion’s stance on violence, it doesn’t matter what it teaches, but only what its followers do and believe that matters. Is that a reasonable assessment of your posts on this subject?
I don’t know what, if anything the New Testament says about homosexuality. But the Torah clearly labels homosexuality a sin & says anyone who commits a homosexual act should be stoned. So unless the New Testament says anything more tolerant than that you’re clearly wrong.
I have a real problem with your claim that Christianity is clear as the driven snow merely because the Gospels do not literally support violence against dissenters. The plain fact is that Christian tradition is full of acts of violence commited against dissenting Christians and other religions (like Judaism). Do you really think all those who followed the Pope’s dictum to war against the infidel Muslims & Jews during the Crusades did so believing the Gospels didn’t support their actions?
It’s very convient to use the 19th century cutoff date which allows you to ignore the travails of Galileo, Joan of Arc, the extermination of the Albigensians, Savanarola, the Inquisition, etc. You can argue that the Gospels don’t specifically encourage these types of acts but again those Christian perpetrators fully believed their actions WERE sanctioned by the Gospels.
Even the devil can quote Scripture and does. The same holds true for intolerant violence-prone Chrisitians.
Not at all.
I read Tawfiq Hamid’s personal story and you clearly have misunderstood his critical thinking of Salafi Islam. He clearly differentiates between Salafi Islam and Quranic Islam; one drove him to loose his perspective of humanity and the other let’s him practice his religion while feeling at peace with non-muslims.
Sadly Richard, I think that you are a propagandist who belongs at Fox News. They provide short messages to readers who like to hear Bill O’Reiley tell them what they want to hear. Do you simply not like to read more than one paragraph before you form an opinion on an individual? Are you sure you’re not a republican in disguise?
If you want to make peace with fellow Muslims you must understand them in more detail and know what their internal struggles and conflicts are. They have multiple interpretations of how Islamic laws apply and Salifi (of which Wahabbi is one sect) preaches the most abhorrent practices that breach many basic human rights.
You need to support the individuals that practice Islam and struggle for Tikun Olam, There are many interpretations of Jewish laws and Tikun Olam is our struggle to find the right interpretation that let’s us live in peace with our fellow human beings.
You must be certain of the truth before you defame a fellow human being. Tikun Olam is not about spreading propaganda and bashing struggling souls; that is what we have Fox Channel for. Seriously, if you’re just another propagandist then go work for them – you’ll make more money.
Tawfiq is a practicing Muslim, not Evangelical Christian. He is permitted to describe his experience of Salafi Islam as it affected his life in a very negative way. He is trying to heal Islam and make Muslim lives better, and as a result the world will benefit; Tikun Olam means fixing out world and that is what Tawfiq is trying to do.
I’ll stop writing now as I know you don’t like to read too much.
Shalom and may you learn what Tikun Olam means.
Yehuda Isaac from Seattle.
Naveed Haq, a Muslim Pakistani, was incited to shoot, kill and wound innocent people working at the Jewish Federation of Greater Seattle. He was taught that hating and killing anyone who did not please his views was justified. His mentors in the Pacific North West continue to incite hatred. To stop them, join me in a unified voice with fellow Americans and speak out against the circumstances that allowed this to happen. Tikun Olam cannot be achieved through the teaching of hatred.
@Yehuda Isaac: I see. So Reb Yehuda is an expert on Islam. Is that because of the academic degree you have on the subject? Or the numerous references works you’ve read (& we’re not counting anti-Islamic screeds as “reference works”). Would you mind telling us where your pedigree comes from?
And also, would you mind proving that Hamid still considers himself a Muslim. A quote with a link will do.
Being the insulting snark you are, you neglect to acknowledge that I did considerable research on Hamid before writing this. You’re just upset because people like Hamid confirm all of yr own prejudices about Islam. You don’t want to see a Jew tear down your supposed anti-jihadi poster boy.
Who specifically incited Naveed Haq to hate? You seem to have specific people in mind. Care to enlighten us? Care to enlighten us about yr own Jewish background?
The “ex-Muslim” industry is full of charlatans being carted around by Jewish and Christian extremists for their own political agenda. Shoebat himself is a fraud, so his promotion of this character isn’t a surprise.
Great article!
You know, anybody who is cited on this lunatic Shoebat`s website,should be disregarded. It is all same enraged, rabid gang. The preach end to extremism , yet so flagrantly expose that of their own.
Good job Mr. Silverstein, cleaning out this garbage .
I can’t believe how bad are you, misusing the Hebrew words “Tikun Olam” that is redemption, improvement, of the world.
To transform even a Iota of our physical world into a better place.
Please explain what is wrong in the article published by Dr. Hamid March the 8th. on the Wall Street Journal (online.wsj.com) titled “Islam Needs to Prove It’s a Religion of Peace”
It seems that you try to justify everything of the extremist muslims.
Why try to ridicule Dr. Tawfik Hamid or other people that make a change in their lives?
You look like a very leftist group of … shmocks (I’m sure you understand Yiddish).
Shame on you !
Am Israel Chai !!!
Shalom !!!
“Schmocks?” Really. Excuse me while I take a break for a good laugh. It’s “schmucks.” If you want to pretend to love Jews you might try to brush up your Jewishness so you don’t go making a fool of yrself.
As for being a schmuck–it takes one to know one.
Well, Richard, Yiddish actually allows different pronunciations (“shul”-“shil” etc.). Per this Yiddish dictionary it is spelled as
שמאָק
which, by the book I study from (Sheva Zuker), should be pronounced “shmok”. “Schmuck” is indeed the common pronunciation in the US, but I guess it must come from a different region.
I am quite fluent in Yiddish having studied it several years in college. I’ve never ever heard or read the word pronounced or spelled “schmok.”
I guess there is the English “schmuck” and the Yiddish שמאָק (“shmok”). “Schmuck” indeed derives from the Yiddish שמאָק but becomes a word on its own in English, with its own pronunciation and spelling.
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=8&url=http%3A%2F%2Fen.wiktionary.org%2Fwiki%2Fschmuck&ei=UmW5SbqpOoGStQOFzZw8&usg=AFQjCNGnFDWgDA_uREb96_7ApCwl6ABkIQ&sig2=iut49fiJw3bAcVKDv9YbcQ
http://www.yiddishdictionaryonline.com/dictionary/%D7%A9%D7%9E%D7%90%D6%B8%D7%A7.html
It’s a fun digression, I have to say! 🙂
Very mature Richard.
“It takes one to know one” is not a very convincing rebuttal.
More like the response a 10 year old might give.
I really could care less what you think is convincing.
Thank you Peter for your explanations.
Yes, there is life outside the USA, and obviously there is also Jewish people there (Should I say “here”?) 🙂 and we are accustomed to a different pronunciation.
I’m only a lover of Yiddish, but not an expert.
And Mr. Silverstein, you didn’t said even a word about my real question:
‘Please explain what is wrong in the article published by Dr. Hamid March the 8th. on the Wall Street Journal (online.wsj.com) titled “Islam Needs to Prove It’s a Religion of Peace” ‘
Best regards, Shalom!
Clearly. Don’t give me bilge about being “accustomed to a different pronunciation.” I’ve heard Yiddish spoken my entire life including that word & NEVER heard it pronounced that way.
Islam doesn’t need to prove it’s a religion of peace. Islam doesn’t need to prove anything to you or Hamid or anyone else. Tawfiq Hamid needs to prove he isn’t a total fraud as you need to prove your claim to knowing Yiddish isn’t a fraud.
“Islam doesn’t need to prove it’s a religion of peace”. Ok, that’s fine if for you but not for me. I personally quantify religion based on their actions. In this sense, buddhism is one of the most peaceful and Islam is one of the most violent. Of course, Christians & Jews were extremely violent centuries ago, but you don’t see too many christian or jewish nations today that murder homosexuals, or lash their women for “adultery” by being with a non-related male. Personally I am not a fan of any religion. I would say extremist Islam is a very serious threat, which Dr. Hamid addresses acurately.
You judge religions based on yr highly prejudicial notion of them. Islam is no more violent that Judaism or Christianity.
I can’t tell you how many times Islamophobes like you have repeated this argument ad nauseam. Judaism has produced Baruch Goldstein and many other murderers who’ve killed Palestinians as part of an ideological/religious vision. Christians and Muslims kills ea. other fairly regularly in places like Indonesia and Nigeria. I’d say you have a blind spot when it comes to Islam. You see what you want to see & disregard anything inconvenient to you.
Of course that actions are the meter.
The sentence “I can’t tell you how many times Islamophobes like you have repeated this argument ad nauseam.” must be applied to you Mr. owner of the website but we shall write “ANTISEMITES” instead of “Islamophobes”.
I Already wrote about your Jew self hatred and anti Zionist activity, but you censored my post. This is the kind of “happy world” you are offering?
You are mentioning Baruch Goldstein “as a prove”. Prove of what?
As some ill people died, even after going to a Doctor, “medicine” is a fraud?
Please show me a TREND in Judaism that incite killing.
Of course there is always people that think in a violent way BUT they are illegal in Israel, and they are not mainstream in Judaism (actualy Baruch Goldstein was stopped -killed- by the Israel army).
Let me remember taht when the christians made a horrible killing in Lebanon while Israel was an occupying force, about 10% (yes, TEN percent) of Israel population went to the streets and forced the expulsion of Defense Minister Ariel Sharon.
There are 2 thousand millions muslims over the world. I want to see the same: 200 millions in manifestations against the 9/11, the 11-M in Madrid, the killings in Bali, in London, the AMIA bombing in Buenos Aires, recently the killings in Mumbai,etc etc etc.. And I didn’t mention even one of the 1000’s of terror attacks made in Israel.
What are we talking about Mr. schmuck – schmock?
This is a serious violation of my comment rules. GO AND READ THEM VERY CAREFULLY. Your future comments will be moderated and any further violations will cause you to lose your comment privileges.
Extremists settlers represent “a trend in Judaism.” Their interpretation of their religion leads them to murder Palestinians (and even some Israelis including a prime minister). Many Palestinians over the yrs have been murdered by Jewish extremists just as many israelis have been murdered over the yrs. by Muslim extremists. Of course it is illegal to murder Palestinians in Israel. But extremists do it anyway.
As Peter told you, Goldstein was torn to pieces by those he attacked after he’d killed 29 innocent civilians.
As for Sharon after Sabra & Chatilla, he was expelled fr. politics & later came back to be prime minister. He should’ve been expelled fr. politics for life. There are not 2 billion Muslims in the world. Where did you get such a figure? The highest estimate I’ve seen is 1 billion. You really don’t know anything about anything do you?
I really could care less what you want to see. Muslims don’t owe you anything. They have nothing to prove to you or anyone else. Rathe, it’s you who need to prove that you’re not woefully ignorant & prejudiced toward one of the world’s major religions.
Uh, I think you just did. But what you REALLY didn’t mention was the thousands of Israeli attacks & killings of innocent Palestinian civlians. Why not? Could it be that you have a particular animus against Muslims? No, that’s not possible.
I always enjoy commenters who make my life that much easier by banning themselves. Mazel tov, you’ve hit the Trifecta & are hereby banned. Ad hominem insults are a serious breach of the rules. And since you’ve done this twice in a single comment, you’re history.
elZeide, your facts are wrong. Goldstein was not killed by the IDF, he was killed by the crowd praying in the Makhpella. That, of course, doesn’t mean a lot.
You are wrong to suggest that in Israel there is currently a strong voice for peace. The demonstration in the wake of Sabra and Shatilla was a one of a kind event. In the recent years much larger numbers protested peaceful (or percieved as peaceful) initiatives (300,000 Israelis say “No!” to Gaza
Settler expulsion in largest ever Israeli
protest (2005),
200,000 in Tel Aviv protest against Camp
David peace accords (2001)) and only tiny numbers demonstrated the recent Gaza killing spree (15000).
If you already mentioned the Lebanon War and Sabra and Shatilla, then despite the demonstration then, the results speak for themselves. People like Sharon and Eitan who should have been thrown into jail were never punished (Sharon wasn’t “expelled”; he resigned as the MOD but was retained as a ministerwithout portfolio and later continued in his career with no problem) etc. Please, take time to read this detailed report on Sabra and Shatilla and ask yourself whether Israel really dealt with the atrocity in the manner it should have (I sense that you are not aware of the real facts behind the massacre and to what extent Isral was directly involved).
I’m reading this post in order to refute it. It seems to me that the author of this post believes that Islam should stand above criticism and that radical Islam should not be subject to a critique and anyone who dares to do otherwise is a bigot who supposedly hates Muslims. This site is full of BS. Tawfik Hamid is a courageous and heroic man.
Folks, See the refutation of this slanderous post at [URL deleted per comment rules]
From your article: “If any student activities director is reading this post, you should know that if you invite this dude you’re inviting a poster boy for evangelical Christianity and indirectly promoting anti-Arab propaganda”
Why does it matter that he is a former Muslim turned Christian? Would you feel the same about him if he was a former Muslim turned Jew? Is he promoting anti-Arab propaganda or just the truth about Islam? You do know that there are Arab Christians don’t you?
The horrific things that Christians did during the crusades can not be tied to the teachings in the new testament. On the other hand, the horrific things that Muslims do in the name of Allah can be tied to the teachings in the Quran.
for us.”
You’ve just massacred logic, reason and credibility. But thanks for discrediting yr own pt of view so well.
I LOVE your article here…. A member of my forum posted about this guy as proof that Muslims are all EVIL and that Muslims beat their wives etc…..
We are in a huge debate about Islam and the new Oklahoma Amendment baring the use of Sharia Law and INternational law in Oklahoma courts.
I just wrote to Tawfik Hamid to ask him if he is so against this use of Sharia law in the courts, if he would also suggest banning the Catholics and well as Jewish people from using it as well…..
you can visit the forum and read for yourself what has been said about this, as it would take me far too long to write it here.
I am so sick of all of this Islamaphobia….
and the first article that my fellow forum mate posted seemed reasonable… it was about how to combat extremism. So I agreed with that article, but I KNEW he was going to find one that Hamid had written on Sharia law, so I did some digging.
YOU are so RIGHT about this man….
and it does not take a scholar to see it.
First he demonizes ALL of Muslims.
he fails to even mention moderate Muslim cultures, that right there tells me is is doing this to gain something…. Money, fame…. something…. I am just not buying Hamid’s story….
For one, why would I trust a man who already admits to rejoicing over the deaths on 911????
There is just something so FISHY about Hamid, and I am so glad you wrote this article.
It is great to see that no everybody is buying this mans lines.
here is the forum I was talking about.
In case you want to go and read what others are also saying, or if you want to join and jump in the debate 🙂
http://ebayrefugees.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general
Cheers,
JAG
Just an Atheist Gurl From Seattle… that lives in Sweden
PS…. I hope I did not break any rules by giving you this link. If so, please accept my apology….
I wrote about Oklahoma as well here, which may interest you or other members of the board:
https://www.richardsilverstein.com/2010/11/15/oklahoma-god-damn/
I must congratulate you for this article. I am a Muslim and I have grown up a very religious family. Much of what these islamophobes talk about Islam is complete non sense. Muslim children are not taught to kill others. They are taught the morals which are common to judaism and christianity and other religions. I was always taught (my parent lived by the example) is taking care of others, respecting parents, prayers and fasting, being merciful to all including animals. I remember in my childhood there was a major flooding in my area and food became scarce and hunger became wide spread. My mom will go hungry but she will give away food if anyone came asking. That selflessness has lasting impact on my own approach to life and this is what i teach my children as well. This is something people of all faith can relate to.
I wish all people can live by the golden rule “like for others what you like for yourselves”. This is part of my religion and I believe it is also part of Christianity and judaism. This , I believe, is the only way to peace and justice in this world. But this also requires that we expose and marginalize hat mongers.
So Keep up the good work
Great article brother, I appreciate the effort you have put in. Keep up the good work.
Peace be with you
As a Muslim, I greatly appreciate your analyses, and completely agree with the comments of Zingo above. I also appreciate many efforts from several Israelian officials or civilians in the recent years, towards Muslim Palestinians, that gives victory of humanity and justice over hatred and narrow-mindedness. God (The Glorious, The Most High) has promised that the children of Abraham (Peace and Blessings be with him) will be as numerous as dusts in the land, as stars in the sky. Humanity have discovered billions of billions of stars. So the number of the children of Abraham will continue to grow beyond these 7 billions actually. We should work for the peace and love between humans now and for the later generations.
Peace be with you.