You’ll have to forgive Ali Baher, chair of the Arab student body at the Hebrew University, for thinking he lived in a democracy. After all, one of its hallmarks is the right both to say what you think and also to refuse to do something you find objectionable–like shaking President Shimon Peres’ hand:
The chairman of Hebrew University’s Arab student body was apprehended by university security personnel on Sunday after he refused to shake the hand of visiting President Shimon Peres’ hand.
Ali Baher was detained for three hours after calling Peres’ hand a “murderer of children.” His student ID card was confiscated until a disciplinary committee convenes to review his conduct.
“I have a right to not shake hands with those I do not want to shake hand with,” Baher told Haaretz on Sunday.
But either Israel is not the democracy is touts itself to be or the Hebrew University follows different rules than the nation of which it is a part. Baher was roughed up by University security personnel, apparently with nothing better to do than harass Arab students for partaking of their democratic right to be left alone, even when patriotism calls in the form of the nation’s president:
A note of background: when I studied at the Hebrew University in the 1970s, it was known as a bastion of right-wing student activism. After all, Tzachi Hanegbi (who told me personally during that time that he favored the rebuilding of the (Third) Temple) and Avigdor Lieberman were stalwarts of the thuggish student political group, Kastel during that period. Apparently, little has changed. The school still barely tolerates its Arab students, viewing them with the same suspicion as much of the rest of the country’s Jewish citizens.
Do I think Shimon Peres is a murderer of children? No. But then again I’m not an Israeli Arab and if I were I wouldn’t be terribly eager to pall around with Peres myself. Even as a Jew and progressive Zionist, Peres leaves me cold for the overall mediocrity of his political achievement during his career. So why shouldn’t Ali Baher have the same right as any citizen of any reasonable democracy–to refuse to do something he finds politically odious?
What is especially sensitive for Israeli Jews is their view that Arab citizens reject the notion of a Jewish state. When in truth, Arabs are psychologically more integrated into the state than anyone has a right to expect given how inferior their status is. For Baher to refuse the president’s hand only serves to reinforce the notion that Jews have that Arabs are an ungrateful third column in their midst.
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“Apparently, little has changed. The school still barely tolerates its Arab students, viewing them with the same suspicion as much of the rest of the country’s Jewish citizens.” Care to provide more evidence of this claim? Or are you simply going to extrapolate your analysis on your studies in the 1970s (once again your lack of first-hand experience of Israeli society hinders your analysis) and this sorry story?
For my part, I studied at Hebrew U over the summer, with students from all over the world – including East Jerusalem -and everyone seemed to live and let live. Now, I’m not going to pretend that there aren’t problems on campus, just like I’m not going to pretend that there aren’t problems of racism in Israeli society. But to say that the school “still barely tolerates its Arab students” (not to mention the barely disguised glee at this story) is wide of the mark.
@Alex Stein: You studied at the Hebrew U. for one summer & I studied there for 2 separate academic years. I think I have a little more experience than you on campus to judge this issue.
And if you studied with students fr. E. Jerusalem I suppose you can provide statements fr. them that they did not suffer any discrimination during their time on campus?
You mistake “glee” for satire. There IS a diff. Perhaps you should brush up on your Swift and Twain before you attempt to [mis]characterize the intent of my post. I do not feel glee when Israeli Arabs are treated this way. I feel immense anger and sadness. I feel a nation that betrays what its values should be. The satire is an attempt to transform those emotions into something that will transcend mere anger. Unfortunately, you don’t seem to understand that in yr desire to transform me into an anti-Zionist or anti-Israel blogger.
After my anecdote about studying at the Hebrew U for a summer, I explicitly qualified that by saying “I’m not going to pretend there aren’t problems on campus etc”; the purpose of that being that I wasn’t prepared to extrapolate from one experience a thorough assessment of the situation.
You, however, seem to have no problem with that. What’s even more fantastic, though, is that you see no issue with using your experiences in the 1970s to extrapolate the charge that Arab students are “barely tolerated”.
One other thing: once again the commenter has to produce evidence where you don’t have to. I say I studied with East Jerusalemites without getting any sense of any discrimination and am asking to produce statements from them verifying the fact. You are able to claim that Arab students are “barely tolerated” based on one awful little episode (outlined in the Haaretz story) and your time chin-wagging with Tzachi Hanegbi.
In that regard, by the way, I hope I don’t have to remind you of our discussion about how actually being in Israel might potentially enrich your analysis.
And, for the record, I have never called you an anti-Israel or anti-Zionist blogger. But intellectually second-rate? No doubt.
The child killer accusation is probably about the “Grapes of Wrath” operation in 1996, particularly the shelling of Qana (which was replayed in 2006).
http://hrw.org/reports/1997/isrleb/Isrleb.htm
@Donald: or the Kafr Qassem massacre, whose 52th anniversary was just last week – Peres was defense minister back then. Yes, he’s so far the only one to have uttered something like an apology last year, however little and late.
Peres was NOT Defense Minister in 1956, he was probably Deputy Defense Minister. Prime Minister Ben-Gurion held the Defense portfolio.
Don’t worry, right-wing, religious “settlers” are treated worse. A couple of years ago, a group of outstanding soldiers were presented to the then-IDF Chief of Staff Dan Halutz. One soldier, who was one of the Jews expelled from Gush Katif , refused to shake Halutz’s hand. The media started a storm of “national outrage” and demanded he be punished, which he was (I don’t recall if he was thrown out the army or what). The IDF illegally released information from his personal file to the media in order to slander him. He filed suit in court and I believe he won.
I don’t know why you would think Arab students are “barely tolerated in the University”. I am sure you are aware that a high percentage of the professors support the Left in Israel which would mean they hold Arab students in higher regard than Judea/Samaria settlers, or “right-wingers”. HaNegbi’s and Lieberman’s reign at the HU was 30+ years ago.
@bar_kochba132: I sit half-corrected: in 1956 Peres was Director General of the MoD, the minister himself was Ben-Gurion, as you say.
If the army incident did happen as you say, then they probably went too far. The apparent display of militarism by the media is unfortunately the norm rather than the exception. But the not-so-little difference is that Halutz was the soldier’s chief superior officer, while Peres is nobody’s superior. He’s the chief ceremonial representative of the state, that’s all.
I have no idea how many Israeli professors “support the Left” (which, coming from a right-winger, can mean anything), but agreeing or disagreeing with a student’s politics is an entirely different animal than holding some students in higher professional regard than others for reasons unrelated to their performance. If you can level such accusations, I guess you have conclusive (i.e., not anecdotal) evidence that “left-leaning” profs discriminate against “right-leaning” students more than is conversely the case?
And regarding the soldier who refused to shake hands with that scumbag Halutz, it is only fitful to note that it was Gideon Levy who was one of the voices coming to his defense.
Translation of the first lines (found elsewhere on the net):
@Alex Stein: When it’s convenient to you, you claim that my not living in Israel tarnishes my ability to understand Israeli society. And when my analysis IS based on a period when I did live in Israel, you conveniently dismiss it as being out of date.
The fact that the leader of Arab students on campus was treated as a criminal for exercising his rights as a citizen is indicative of the way the campus treats Arab students. It was largely the way it treated them in 1980 when I last was on campus and nothing unfortunately has substantially changed.
This is not a “little” incident. I assure you that no Arab student on campus sees it the way you do. And if it is, you should be able to show us that life on campus for Arabs is a happy one. I’m not asking the world. Just show us some examples of shiny happy Arab students.
As for being “intellectually second-rate”–right back at you, bud.
Just to be clear again: your entire evidence for your major claim that Arab students at Hebrew U are “barely tolerated” is this story. And when someone calls you on it, you demand that they go round and take sworn testimony from students to prove this is the case (even though I never said that everything was hunky-dory).
As for the story, I’d like to know more details. We both agree that Mr Baher should have every right to shake or not shake the hand of who he wants. We’d also agree that it’s outrageous he be called to account for it. But I think it’s also important to question the original gesture. I’d like to know if he randomly happened to be there when Mr Peres was shaking hands. Given his high position on campus, I’d guess (although the story doesn’t confirm this) that there was some kind of organised reception, which he presumably knew about in advance.
In this sense, it would be interesting to compare his gesture to David Grossman at a prize ceremony during a few months after the Lebanon war. He stated in advance that he would not be willing to shake Olmert’s hand. This is important: he managed to make his point without simply being provocative.
I wonder Mr Baher knew in advance that Mr Peres would thrust his hand at him, and whether the wiser course of action would have been to publicly announce that he wouldn’t be willing to shake the said hand. Gesture politics are rarely effective.
As for the chicken and egg debate over your period in Israel, you know fully well the reason I’m questioning your sudden use of your time on the Hebrew University campus is because it took place in the 1970s, and as such is obviously of limited (although not zero) use.
@bar_kochba132:
You’ve given away yr ideolgoical proclivities.
He should have been disciplined. First, unlike Baher he was a soldier, not a civilian. Therefore, different standards & rules apply. Second, he was participating in a military ceremony at which he knew Halutz would shake his hand. He could’ve refused to attend the ceremony & so avoided the situation. Since he did not, one can assume it was a deliberate provocation on the soldier’s part which deserved punishment.
This, of course, is a non sequitur in addition to being nonsensical. Besides, many (though not all) Hebrew U. professors are quite right wing.
@Alex Stein:
My but you are twisting things. Doing a Google search or actually contacting an Arab student you befriended during the summer & asking what their view is of this matter–is that “taking sworn testimony?” No, it’s just doing garden variety research which appears too much for you.
The English language version of the article only stated that Peres was shaking hands w. students on the lawn on campus. That doesn’t sound like an organized reception to me. Though I have no idea what the context was.
Just as your single summer sojourn on campus is “obviously of limited (though not zero) use.”
Richard – I acknowledged it’s of limited use. Here: “Now, I’m not going to pretend that there aren’t problems on campus, just like I’m not going to pretend that there aren’t problems of racism in Israeli society.” and here: “I explicitly qualified that by saying “I’m not going to pretend there aren’t problems on campus etc”; the purpose of that being that I wasn’t prepared to extrapolate from one experience a thorough assessment of the situation.”
I just presented one anecdote to contrast with yours. You are the one who made a major claim. Arab students, you said, are “barely tolerated”. I made no major claims apart from that it is impossible to make that claim on the sole basis of the handshaking incident or your time on campus in 1980.
The story doesn’t seem to provide enough details; I am sure they will come out with time.
Richard said:
I am not convinced. As Gideon Levy notes, there is no law or army regulation requiring you shake hands with your military superior (you are required to salute, but that’s a different matter), so, the soldier was right to refuse it. I agree that it was a deliberate provocation, but, well, tough luck, Halutz. I am sure the soldier felt a little bit more than “a light bump on the plane” (this refers to Halutz’s notorious quote about what he feels when releasing a bomb.) Also, keep in mind that the soldier was there to receive a citation, so, why would he skip a ceremony honoring him? Only because he might be required to shake hands with a despicable human being like Halutz?
Let me see if I understand. an Israeli student is engaged by security guards for calling the president of Israel a child murderer.. and its a hideous crime.
How easy to forget that a short while ago, an American student was TASERED and arrested, in the US of A for hurling comments at John Kerry in a university in Florida.
double standard and taking things out of context simply to slur Israel is an understatement here.
As someone considerably to the right of you, I dont think that Baher should have been disciplined for not shaking Peres hand. I might not want to shake his hand either. However, had the President or PM been a member of the Likud, and Baher not shaken his hand, would there be this much kerfuffle. The real shock here is that an icon of the left is snubbed, and thats not supposed to happen. Perhaps Mr Baher cannot tell the difference between Peres and Lieberman.
who cares. it will be a great day when all of the worlds problems are solved and not shaking hands is newsworthy
@Duncan: I seem to remember the event at the Kerry rally did make some waves in the blogosphere, though I don’t know if Richard wrote about it. Same with other, similar incidents, most recently at the RNC in the Twin Cities. Those calling such behaviour by the “security” goons unacceptable were generally on the progressive side, with gleeful commentary coming from the right, we shouldn’t protest so much, had it coming, etc., the usual drivel.
It’s an age-old trope of the right to deflect criticism by pointing a finger to some injustice elsewhere. The West German version went like “you can go over there (the GDR) if you don’t like it here”, and the right-wingers on the other side (i.e. the Stalinists) had a similar line of non-reasoning. Albert Camus was criticised by Gabriel Marcel for denouncing Marcel’s fellow Catholic Francisco Franco because the other bad boy – Stalin – was so much badder. (I’d like to give you Camus’ reply, in which he ripped Marcel a well-deserved new one, if I only had an English version.)
“if I only had an English version”
Found it: http://tinyurl.com/5fhndq
fiddler,
No, it doesn’t have anything to do with pointing the finger to some injustice elsewhere.
It is a simple way of showing, that a student in Israel faced much lesser consequences for much more extreme action than a student in America, and the important point is, that it shows that him being an Arab student is exploiting this whole issue and shows the double standard.
Its common sense, you defame a president of a nation, you better be ready to face *some* hassle. whether we agree with it or not- which is completely in the realm of the hypothetical, philosophical, and intellectual.
@Duncan Idaho:
This is utter narischkeit. The Arab student didn’t “defame” Peres. He exercised his democratic right to speak his mind by refusing Peres’ hand. And the Hebrew University’s response is to treat its Arab student as if he’s spit on Herzl’s grave. It’s ludicrous. In a democracy, citizens are not serfs, except in Israel (& only certain citizens at that).
Nonsense. you are either ignorant of the original story, or you are twisting it for your own ends.
Not only did he refuse to shake Peres hand but Ali Baher called called Peres a “murderer of children.”
If thats speaking ones mind, than its not a democracy we are living it, but a zoo, which lets hostile people get their way.
@Duncan Idaho: I will concede I was wrong in one thing: Baher did defame Peres. And I have no problem with what he said. You seem ignorant of what the term “democracy” means. It means a citizen is free to speak his mind about anyone who represents him in political office. And yes, the citizen is even allowed to call his president a “murderer of children.” This is called free speech and it is enshrined in Israel’s Declaration of Independence as a core value of the State. And btw, it doesn’t indicate there that this right doesn’t extend to Arab citizens.
Only autocrats like you believe that democracy is a “zoo.” You’d undoubtedly prefer more order and to see the trains run on time.
There is not a single nation on the face of this planet with absolute and complete freedom of speech.
most democracies recognize some limitations on freedom of speech.
Hate speech, slander, libel, disruption of public order are all issues taken into consideration in maintaining and protecting freedom of speech from abuse and the well being of the citizens.
After saying that, this whole discussion is hypothetical, because Baher was not engaged by the legal authorities of Israel, but by security guards who were present at the place after causing his little riot together with his friends (again read the full story, before you comment ignorantly again)
And again, it has nothing to do with him being an Arab, if a non Arab student would cause a scene in the event, he would be engaged by security personnel as well. simple as that.
Hey everyone (and especially Richard),
You’ll be glad to know that Ali won the fight. check out the blog for all the detail…
many thanks for your support 🙂
@Huji folks: This is great news! Please send my best wishes to Ali. I’m proud of him for standing up for democracy and civil rights in Israel.
Mealy-mouthed hypocrites. As an Israeli who was gullible enough to think Israel is a democracy simply because he was taught this at high school, I am simply appalled.
Why is it that nothing ever works properly in this country without having to make the perpetrators of anti-democratic acts look like utter idiots? Why can’t we simply acknowledge the importance of enlightened, liberal values for their own sake?
Ashkenazi racisam is the starting point to all the
problems in the middle east’ all the rest is dirty
politics…בחורבן הציונות הכוזרואשכנזית ננוחם