19 thoughts on “Death in Bilin: IDF Doctors Found ‘Prolonged Exposure’ to CS Gas Lethal – Tikun Olam תיקון עולם إصلاح العالم
task-attention.png
Comments are published at the sole discretion of the owner.
 

  1. There is of course no justification for the killing whatsoever.

    No excuses.

    But please don’t say all the time that the demonstrations are “non-violent” from the Palestinian side. Sometimes there is stone throwing, and sometimes violence in the form of hitting soldiers with sticks, etc.Sometimes soldiers too are injured.

    Who started? No idea, but it’s not “non-violent” and neither side belongs to the 36 righteous.

    Again, no excuse for the killing.

    1. # Shmuel)
      “No excuse for the killing”. Thank you, the rest isn’t really necessary.

      I’ve heard the haredim can be pretty ‘violent’ too when they protest. Never heard of anyone killed, though.

      1. Every idealistic and/or fundamentalist protester can be and usually is violent. From nationalist Palestinians to Jewish settlers, Haredim, and sometimes the far left.

        1. Yeah, but 21 persons have been killed protesting against the Wall. How many Haredim or Jewish settlers have been killed during protests ? We know from various Israeli Jewish sources that the IDF acts differently whether they deal with Jewish/Western or Palestinian protesters.

    2. THey key is that there had been absolutely no violence whatsoever at the time of the tear gas attack that killed Jawaher. This is confirmed by mulitple eyewitnesses. That’s why I use these terms. When there is stone throwing it’s almost always after the initial assault fr. the IDF. Were there no tear gas or shooting fr. the IDF there’d be no violence. In other words, whatever small amt. of violence there might be is entirely provoked.

      1. I have no link as I can’t remember where I read this. But I’ve read that Mistaravim infiltrate the non-violent protests in the West Bank, that they act very violently, and the source said that that’s how they realized they were infiltrators. I know this happened also recently during the protest againt a right-wing rally in Umm al-Fahm. An infiltrator was wounded when participating in the protest (Maan News).
        If someone has any informations on the West Bank mistaravim, I’ll be grateful.

        1. RE: “I’ve read that Mistaravim infiltrate the non-violent protests in the West Bank…” – Deïr Yassin
          FROM HAARETZ, 09/24/10:

          The IDF has admitted in court in the past that mistaravim sometimes joined the rock-throwers. They say they did so in order not to blow their cover. No exposure could be greater. For who can distinguish the pretend Palestinian rock-throwers from all the actual Palestinians who wish to make their voices heard – and say who is really interested in throwing rocks. Disguises are always deceiving, dependent on context. If rock-throwing is absolutely reprehensible, then joining in is just as reprehensible…

          SOURCE – http://www.haaretz.com/weekend/magazine/slings-and-errors-1.315482

          1. Thank you, dickerson3870.
            In fact, the source that I’m referring to went much further. According to him, the infiltrators did not throw stones in order not to blow up their cover. They actaully initiated the violence in non-violent protests. I think it was some Israeli peace activist, former IDF.

          2. FROM A COMMENT ON 02/02/10 BY DIANE MASON AT MONDOWEISS:

            (relevant excerpts)…Riyad Muhammad Yassin Barnat, a 28-year-old construction worker and farmer, father of four, and ‘Alian Ibrahim Ahmad Abu Rahmeh, a 29-year-old school-bus driver, father of two, have been detained by the Israeli army following a peaceful demonstration in their West Bank village of Bil’in on 28 April 2005
            …Some 500 Palestinian villagers and around 200 Israeli peace activists participated in the demonstration. They informed the Israeli troops present at the scene, through loudspeakers and in Hebrew, that the march was strictly peaceful. But as the demonstrators gathered on the outskirts of the village and began marching in the direction of the fence/wall, Israeli forces shot tear gas at them, pushed and shoved some of them, and fired rock salt projectiles, injuring several of the demonstrators.
            Several masked mistaravim (a Hebrew term meaning ‘those who pretend to be Arabs’), undercover agents belonging to the Israeli Prison Service started to behave aggressively and threw stones at the soldiers. When the Palestinian villagers called on them to stop using violence and to leave the demonstration, they revealed their identity, pulled out their weapons, and arrested two Palestinian and four Israeli demonstrators…

            SOURCE – http://mondoweiss.net/2010/02/50-years-after-we-were-liberated-by-north-carolina-lunchcounter-sit-in-times-calls-west-bank-protests-theatrical-spectacle.html

          3. Thank you so much, Dickerson3870.
            That was exactly the kind of things I’d been reading. Call you next time I can’t find my keys 🙂

      2. When her brother Bassem was shot in the chest with a tear gas canister in 2009, there was no sign of violence then, either. Bassem was non-violent, discouraged stone throwing and always asked the soldiers to put down their weapons and listen. He wound up dead and no one was ever charged in his murder.

    3. Dear Shmuel,

      What are the sources of your information on the violence against the Israeli soldiers at Bil’in?

      I only went to the demo three times but I never saw a soldier hit with sticks nor anything like it. We always got tear gassed though. Sometimes the tear gas cannisters were thrown back and we cheered when the soldiers ran away from their own chemical weapons. Do you disapprove of that too?

      The stone throwing by the shabab takes place at a seperate part of the fence, or after the main demo has dispersed.

      I have never seen film of any soldier being hit at Bil’in either.

      If you don’t believe me why not go and take a look for yourself? But if not please refrain from regurgitating misinformation.

      As to who started it, I would say the occupying forces, the ones who stole the land, the ones who have ignored the Israeli Supreme Court decision to re-route the fence, the ones who occupy Palestinian land in defiance of the Fourth Geneva Convention and UN resolutions. Did you not know this either? You do have a lot of homework to do!

  2. RE: “The problem was the human beings (let’s be charitable, shall we) who determined to use the gas in such a way that it not only can, but will likely kill people.” – R.S.
    MY SNARK: No, let’s not be charitable. I’m convinced they are actually “Pod People”. “They come from another world.”
    FROM WIKIPEDIA:

    (excerpts) Invasion of the Body Snatchers received universal acclaim from critics and is considered one of the best films of 1956.[6][7][8] The film holds a 97% “Fresh” rating on the review aggregate website Rotten Tomatoes.[9] In recent years, critics have hailed the film as a “genuine Sci-Fi classic”[10] and one of the “most resonant” and “one of the simplest” of the genre.[11] The BBC wrote, “The sense of post-war, anti-communist paranoia is acute, as is the temptation to view the film as a metaphor for the tyranny of the McCarthy era.”[12]…
    …The film is widely viewed as a covert indictment of McCarthyism, with the turning of people into their characterless doubles when they fall asleep representing the dangers faced of America turning a blind eye to McCarthyism. Others, though, have viewed it as a metaphor of alienation in modern mass civilization, or an allegory for the loss of personal autonomy in the Soviet Union, or of bland conformity in postwar Dwight D. Eisenhower-era America. It is sometimes argued to be an indictment of the damage to the human personality caused by reductionist modern ideologies of Right and Left…

    Invasion of the Body Snatchers (Pod People) – http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invasion_of_the_Body_Snatchers
    Invasion of the Body Snatchers, Official Trailer [1956] (VIDEO, 02:20) – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFnSxeDfENk

  3. The following texts from the Talmud EXPLICITLY forbid the killing of non-Jews:

    Tosafot, Avodah Zarah 26b sv. Velo; Maimonides, Mishneh Torah, Hilchot Rotze’ach 2:11, Hilchot Avodah Zarah 10:1; R. Yoel Sirkes, Bayit Chadash, Yoreah Deah 158; Taz, Yoreh Deah 158:1; Beit Meir, Even HaEzer 17:3; R. Yosef Babad, Minchat Chinuch, 93:2; R. Avraham Yishayahu Karelitz, Chazon Ish, Bava Kamma 10:16.

    Now, how do we not know this is war? Let’s ask the poster boy for dishonesty:

    “If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more ‎violence. If the Jews put ‎down their weapons ‎today, there would be no ‎more Israel”‎ ~Benjamin Netanyahu

    What do you do to figure out the truth? Simply invert what he said: “If Israel put down its weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Palestinians put down heir weapons today, the Palestinians would be ethnically cleansed, occupied under even harsher circumstances, or otherwise kept in a diminutive status.”

    Cast Lead is the prime example. “10,000 rockets” (figure probably exaggerated) killed less than you can find pictures of unique Palestinian BABIES if you simply type “Gaza” into Google Image Search. 10,000 so-called rockets killed less than the Carmel Fire.

    Now compare the statistics, or just simply look at this site which accurately compares them for you:
    http://www.ifamericansknew.org

    I want the replies to my post to show CONTRADICTORY EVIDENCE, not propaganda, not opinion, but real and substantive evidence. Thank you.

    1. Persian, I saw your post last night when I posted mine, but didn’t have a chance to really read it until now.

      Anyone who tries to post “contradictory evidence” will be spouting hasbara, i.e., lying. In fact, if one were to list all the incidents where Israeli soldiers killed Palestinian civilians during the past year alone, or stole land or poured sewage on farm fields, destroyed olive groves, bombed factories, flew fighter jets over Gaza in a threatening manner, shut off water, tore down homes and entire villages, you would find more justification for the Palestinians to go to war against Israel than any reasons Israel could come up with to justify attacking Gaza.

  4. I have watched so, so many videos of the Bilin demonstrations and I know one thing – the Israelis start firing tear gas as soon as the demonstrators come within range. They don’t wait for any stones to be thrown or for any other perceived aggressive acts, they just do it, and they do a lot of it.

    Years ago I took a basic course on handling and administering tear gas – at the time, I worked in a prison and I took the training as part of my job. One thing that the instructor was very, very clear about was that CS gas is deadly in heavy doses, so you must be very, very careful how you use it.

    Richard, you’re right. The IOF doesn’t give a crap if it kills Palestinians. What I find so disgusting is the lying – it’s like a child would lie with its hand in the cookie jar. It’s the cookies’ fault for being there, not the child’s fault for taking them. Any cookies taken were defective so it didn’t hurt anything to take them, right? According to the Israelis, all the Palestinians got what they deserved. The people who died on the Mavi Marmara got what they deserved. The 1,400 people who died in Cast Lead got what they deserved.

    I just wish they would explain why they think they are justified in killing people who object to having their land stolen. I’m waiting to hear this one, but I imagine it will be, “it’s what they deserve.”

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

Share via
Copy link