45 thoughts on “After Deportation, Shyne Turns to Black-Hats for Redemption, to Score Points for Immigration Appeal – Tikun Olam תיקון עולם إصلاح العالم
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  1. You know, I’m a regular reader of your blog and I usually agree with you, but I find the tone of this piece to be a bit troubling. Maybe it is my lack of awareness of the Orthodox community as a non-Jew myself, but I think you’ve pre-judged this man’s conversion with very little evidence other than that he’s a rapper who was once involved in a crime. Yet you are skeptical of his redemption because he was once involved in a crime. This is circular logic unless you don’t believe in redemption at all. Furthermore, this guy was a third-stringer on a mediocre team; it’s unlikely that his guest verses on Mase songs have generated enough income for a Lamborghini and perhaps his teachers know this. I don’t know what he’s trying to achieve and I don’t especially care but I do think that what he’s doing–entering into a community not exactly known for contemporary views on race, gender, outsiders, etc.–can’t possibly be as straightforward or as negative as you suggest. And if your beef is with the dilution of conversion, I think you have other people to take it up with; namely the state of Israel who has long oscillated the definitions of Jewishness and conversion in order to maintain Jewish Supremacy in Israel.

    1. Maybe it is my lack of awareness of the Orthodox community as a non-Jew myself

      Yes, I’d say it is. You should read up on the ultra Orthodox. Not a nice bunch a folks. They’d don’t think much of you non Jews unless you’re planning on converting and bringing bundles of cash with you.

      I have no problem with anyone converting to Judaism as long as their motives are sincere. I don’t know what his motives are, but they are at best clouded.

      1. Then I think the question should be more a critique of the orthodox community and their involvement with high-profile converts than speculation about his motives. You did leave out quite about from the Times piece that discussed his relationship to religion, the bible, and Judaism even prior to his arrest and contradicts the general thrust of your post.

        I don’t especially know why I am defending this guy but like I said above, it seems to me that the problem is the structure of Jewish conversion and it’s relationship to the state of Israel and the POLITICAL motivations behind different types of conversions.

        Finally, in your reply you say this: “I have no problem with anyone converting to Judaism as long as their motives are sincere. I don’t know what his motives are, but they are at best clouded.”

        Which is a lot weaker than what you actually said in your post: “In other words, his conversion is a shameless publicity stunt meant to aid in his regaining his U.S. residency while also keeping his career in the news.”

        Anyway, good luck with everything, and I will keep reading.

        1. You did leave out quite about from the Times piece that discussed his relationship to religion, the bible, and Judaism even prior to his arrest

          Look, anyone who is serious about Judaism on any level doesn’t shoot guns at other human beings (except if you’re in the IDF, then it’s OK [irony alert]). So frankly, I could care little about what Shyne did or believed when he was 6 or 10 or whatever. At the very least, he failed to absorb some basic values & teachings of Judaism when he took up the gun.

          I’m not claiming that Jews don’t do the bad things Shyne has done. Of course they have. But a Jew who takes his ethical tradition seriously acts in certain ways & avoids certain behaviors at which Shyne has been distinctly unsuccessful.

          I do believe his conversion was basically a publicity stunt. Of course, there may’ve been other motives, there always are. But I think I understand what the basic outlines of this matter are.

      2. I could not progress straight from my undergrad to my MA/PhD because of ill health and my own responsibilities as a carer, so I decided to approach some people within the local Charedi community (my town has one of the biggest ultra-orthodox communities in Britain) to ask if anyone would be willing to tutor me in Biblical Hebrew and Yiddish so that I could at least keep my language skills up to scratch. I was bewildered by the sheer hostility and suspicion that this request generated. I doubt that the unfriendliness is directly linked to their version of Judaism, though. I think that if you adhere to an ethical code that teaches you to hold yourself distinct from Gentiles, one of two things happens: either you turn your identity into a barrier against which no ‘outsider’ can ever measure up, or you grow to feel so comfortable in your identity that you develop a deep respect for other people’s. I have met plenty of Charedim who fell into the latter camp – very warm and welcoming people. Unfortunately there seem to be plenty in the former camp too.

        1. Why do I get the feeling that if he insulted every single person belonging to a different religious way of life, say, qutbism, you would have no problem?

          If the religious way of life is hating everyone else, than yes, every single person belonging to it is at fault.

          1. I don’t know why YOU in particular get that feeling, but I’ll have a guess based on my experiences with other people:

            You get that feeling because you personally have extreme biases. When someone confronts you with anything that flies in the face of those ideologies or beliefs, you find it difficult to accept their arguments, even if you can’t find a flaw in their logic. You therefore project evil onto those statement in order to feel content with your ideology without having to defend it.

            Personally, I do have a problem with insulting every single person belonging to any particular group in unfair generalizations.

            Also, do you actually believe that the ‘way-of-life’ for the ultra-orthodox is hating everyone else?

          2. You don’t know anything about what I know either about Judaism or the Haredim (which a substantial amt.). You make a major mistake in attributing motives to my views that are mere guesses & suppositions on yr part.

            I don’t know about Duck, but Haredim generally are either afraid of, contemptuous of, or hate all who are outside the fold. Of course, there are individual Haredim who do not fit this generalization. But overall as a movement these are views that Haredi Judaism holds toward anyone outside its narrow fold.

          3. I didn’t ‘make a major mistake.’ I chose my words very carefully, and they are very clearly intended for Duck. I already know that you believe the hating others is a way-of-life for the Haredim because you have stated and implied this belief up and down this post.

            Now, with regards to me making ‘mere guesses and suppositions’ about Duck…
            He opened the door by rhetorically asking a question meant to imply that I have an intrinsic bias where I would refuse to be upset if someone gave an unsavory generalization about some group that wasn’t Jewish. Since I know that I would be upset by this, I simply turned the tables by pointing out that he could be biased in the same way he implied that I was.

            And finally, stop making sweeping generalization about Haredim. You would be immensely upset (and have rightly gotten upset in the past) if and when someone came into your blog and began saying that Muslims are all hateful. So explain why you can generalize another religion like this?

            BTW, saying: “I know them, you don’t” isn’t an explanation. It’s just a reiteration of racist views. It would be like me saying: “I know Muslims and they are generally hateful.”

            Even if you did attribute some group of Haredim that are genuinely hateful people, would that at all imply that they all are generally hateful? It’s very easy to point groups of people in the Muslim world that is radicalized and hateful, but that doesn’t mean one would generalize Muslims as hateful the way you have done for Haredim.

          4. So explain why you can generalize another religion like this?

            Ultra-Orthodoxy is not a “religion.” Is is a sect within Judaism and quite a small one at that (though larger in certain areas of Israel & NYC). So no, my negative views of Haredim have nothing whatsover to do w. my views of Judaism as I believe Haredim represent rump Judaism. That is, they think they’re the last living remnant of real Judaism & that all the rest of us are disgusting corrupt lumps of flesh that will decay and fall by the wayside, leaving them the true heirs of God and the Jewish people.

            racist views

            WHOA! Major comment rule violation! I never said anything whatsoever racist about Haredim. Not a thing. You say another thing in that vein & you’re gone buddy. Haredim once again are NOT Judaism. Your thought & mind is very very sloppy.

            My views about Haredim don’t just relate to their deep distrust veering to contempt for other Jews & certainly non Jews, it relates to their triumphal view of their Jewish observance & the fact that the rest of us are something like scum (unless we of course do a Shyne & join ’em). Not to mention their strong participation in the radical settler movement & their hatred & violence against Arabs in the W. Bank.

          5. Yes, I have extreme bias.

            I have no tolerance towards intolerance.

            Richard already explained pretty much all the reasons for seeing ultra-orthodoxy as such a vile, intolerant group, so I won’t bother.

            I would add, however, that the kind of extreme islam that drives groups like the taliban (like qutbism) are just as vile. I very much doubt you would defend those kinds of groups.
            While I did assume you were biased in favor of judaism (may have been wrong), I myself have no problem with someone insulting every member of an intolerant group, jewish or muslim.

        2. What the hell are you talking about? Black hatters? I insulted ’em? Wah-wah. Big deal. Ask one of ’em what they think of you if you’re Jewish & not one of ’em or if you’re not Jewish. If you knew anything about the Haredim you wouldn’t be exhibiting yr deep ignorance here of what they stand for.

      3. how many hareidim do you know and carry on a dialogue with?

        you just made a general statement about an entire group of people

        such a statement made about a group you do respect, would get the person making such a statement banned from your blog

        i know many frum people of different levels…from modern to ultra

        some, are indeed prejudiced towards others

        most are not and hold dear the concept of tzelem elokim

  2. Does anyone really care? Madonna? Shyne? I am reminded of when Marilyn Monroe married Arthur Miller and converted to Judaism. When I read the article to my mother, her response was; Who needs her? Le plus ça change …..?

  3. The real question is: Which is the only corrupt democracy in the Middle East?

    Need a clue?

    ‘Government corruption is a higher national priority for Israelis than negotiating a peaceful settlement with the Palestinians, according to a new poll by Tel-Aviv University.’

    Surprised?

    1. Dude, I never met Fred Phelps, but I still spit on him from a great height. Don’t go copping this fake ‘how dare he’ attitude because Richard criticizes ultra-Orthodox. You’re just using this in a hasbara attack attempt.

    2. We make judgements on people almost every minute of every day. The reporter gave me a pretty good impression of Shyne’s motives. Too bad you’re such a black-hatter that you can’t bother to see the problematic nature of this mutually beneficial exploitation.

      1. I’m a black-hatter? hahaha wow…I’m not even a Jew or religious! (putting up a tree during christmas is the extent of my faith).

        You insult a man whom you have never met for his religious faith. Furthermore you insult an entire expression of Judaism…how is your attack on Orthodoxy any different from a Haredi’s attack on Reformism?

        You are a juvenile and puerile man Richard. You remind me of the bullies from high school. But…go ahead…call me a black-hatter, hasbaraist, settler, yadda yadda yadda…

        1. Your ignornace of Judaism shows. Haredim are not “Orthodoxy.” They are a strain within Orthodoxy. I’m not attacking all of Orthodox Judaism. God, would all the ignoramuses here do a Wikipedia & read an article on Haredim before betraying yr ignorance here? Please. It spares me having to keep you all after school doing the research you should be doing before you repeat yr ignorance here.

          You are a juvenile and puerile man Richard

          And you, my man, are moderated till you read the comment rules & follow ’em. Any further violations & you’re gone entirely.

          1. It seems that anyone who doesn’t support your narrow views on Zionism and Judaism you accuse of being “ignorant” and not knowing Judaism like you know it.

            Calling Charedi Judaism a “stain” is as bigoted and misguided as calling Reform or Conservative Judaism a “stain”.

            And let’s not forget that you have no idea what the motives of this Shyne fellow are. They could be bad or good. Who knows? You certainly don’t.

            Do you not see that you are simply the flip side of the very people who condemn?

          2. Calling Charedi Judaism a “stain” is as bigoted and misguided as calling Reform or Conservative Judaism a “stain”.

            So is that your feeble way of acknowledging the hatred & disrespect of Haredi Judaism for the rest of us is objectionable to you? What’s that? Speak up, I can’t hear you? Did you mean that or not?

            you have no idea what the motives of this Shyne fellow are.

            I know something that you don’t appear to know: the history of the very type of celebrity who historically has already tried to do precisely what he is trying to do. In fact, Meyer Lansky went through almost the same set of permutations. He was deported & needed a place to land. Unlike Shyne, Israel wouldn’t take him though. But Lansky was hoping to use Israel sacred soil to purify him & his sins. Shyne’s motives aren’t much diff. Except that Shyne hopes that purification process will count for something in the eyes of American Jews who will lobby for him to regain entry to the U.S. when the proper time comes.

            Yes, Shyne’s motives are fairly clear. I’m not claiming that the man may not have convinced himself of his own sincerity & righteousness in all of this. Psychopaths tend to be able convince themselves of a great deal.

  4. RE: “I’ve got to say that I’ve never seen anyone look more elegant in Haredi black hat than Shyne. He’s really stylin’!” – R.S.
    MY COMMENT: Those shades really complete “the look”. Über kewl!

  5. How many Chareidim do you personally know, Richard?

    A few thoughts: No frum person has ever called themselves “ultra-orthodox”. It is considered a very offensive term. The politically correct term is “chareidi”, or “frum”. In an English speaking-context, almost exclusively frum. I’m sure the offensive language you used was inadvertent; you are not going to break down walls and bring more understanding (which is the point of this site) by using slurs.

    If there is going to be “peace in the middle east” it will happen when all sides become more understanding of the Other. Israelis have their work cut out for them in that regard. Similarly, you and your allies will need to become radically more tolerant of your Jewish enemies.

    It would behoove you and your Palestinian allies to get to know more settlers and chareidim: like it or not, these groups already make up a substantial minority on the future State of (Islamic Republic of?) of Palestine. And within a generation or two, will be the majority of your neighbors to the West of the Palestinian Border. If you truly want Peace, then you and your Palestinian allies will need to open your heart and stop hating your Other (chareidim and settlers). (Again, this is not a replacement for the work that Israelis need to do toward understanding their Islamic minority and their diverse neighbors.)

    Does understanding mean you will love everything about the frum’s religious and social choices? No, of course not! But part of making peace is coming to terms that the culture of the Palestinian frum minority (the settlers, orthodox, chareidi, etc . . . ) and their society, religion and culture will be radically different than the Islamic majority. Islamic Palestinian Sumud (صمود‎) is robust enough to celebrate the diversity of its assertive Jewish minority. In fact, the steadfastness, faith, culture and society of Islamic Palestinians will be made stronger by learning how to be tolerant toward their Jewish minority! Its a win-win!

    Not to impose Jewish teachings on you or your Islamic audience – but my religion teaches ואהבת לרעך כמוך – “And Love to your רעה like to Yourself”. I think Mohammed taught something similar. The first step toward reconciliation is for you to work on LOVING your settler and chareidi רעה.

    As for the accusations of racism: If hating on Mohammedans (who come from all sorts of genealogical lines) is racist, then hating on frum people (who are significantly more racially homogenous – they tend to be North African and Eastern European, although not exclusively) by calling them “ultra-orthodox” is racist as well. I think neither is true, but be consistent.

    1. How many progressive Jews do you know? Do I have to personally know a person from a nation or sect before I can comment sensibly on that nation or sect? I don’t personally know any Palestinians living in Gaza or the Territories currently. Does that mean my comments on them or related issues are treif? I know a helluva lot about Haredi Jews. We don’t happen to run in the same social circles if you know what I mean. I don’t generally frequent Williamsburg or West Bank haredi yeshivot, so we don’t rub shoulders.

      Frankly, I don’t care what a Haredi Jew thinks or cares about the term “ultra Orthodox.” That’s a commonly accepted term both in Israel, here & among all Jews (except the thin Haredi slice). They don’t like the term Occupied Territories either & I’m not about to go all fluffy on their behalf over something like this. And “frum” is not the correct term to use since it denotes someone who is “religious,” or anyone who is Orthodox. Haredi are not just frum, or Orthodox. They are a specific sect within the Orthodox movement, hence ultra Orthodox. When they can use respectful terms to relate to Jews like me then I might return the favor.

      you and your allies will need to become radically more tolerant of your Jewish enemies.

      I find it laughable in the extreme when someone who either isn’t Jewish or if he is, comes from so far outside Judaism as to be in another (Sufi) universe, attempts to lecture members of another religion on proper rules of civil discourse. When we need yr help we’ll ask. Till then, go butt into the affairs of a nation or religion which has actually asked for your help.

      It would behoove you and your Palestinian allies to get to know more settlers

      And what makes you presume erronenously that I don’t know settlers? In fact, a number comment here including one who’s actually sympathetic to my politics. You’re stickin’ yr foot in every time you put yr fingers to keyboard fella.

      these groups already make up a substantial minority on the future State of (Islamic Republic of?) of Palestine

      You haven’t a clue how many settlers will remain within Palestine. For yr information, the number will be VERY small. Mostly Rabbi Menachem Froman and his principled followers, who I actually know & admire (I know, shocking isn’t it that I actually know & respect some settlers? see how easily you make an ass of yrself when you make ASS-sumptions?).

      within a generation or two, will be the majority of your neighbors to the West of the Palestinian Border.

      Secular Jews are 70% of Israeli Jewish population & you say with 30 yrs they will be a minority? There is only one way that can happen: if the settler-haredim duopoly get their way & throw roadblocks in the way of Israeli democracy and both force secular Israelis to emigrate in massive numbers AND prevent a peace agreement with the Palestinians. If both of those disasters unfold then you will be right & Israel as a State either will self destruct or not be worth saving. But if normality prevails, Israeli democracy will ultimately prevail, there will be a secular Israeli state, & charedi-settler types will be a minority of the population. BTW, are you a demographic, in addition to a Jewish expert?

      you and your Palestinian allies will need to open your heart

      My heart is open to those it needs to be open & neither my heart nor any other part of me needs yr unsolicited advice. Aren’t there Sufis somewhere in the world who need saving? Why have you graced us with yr superior grace, wit & wisdom?

      stop hating your Other

      Maybe you should start studying some of heinous acts of hate & violence of these people you so beseech me to love before you talk out a certain part of yr anatomy that knows no wisdom nor brains.

      the frum’s religious and social choices?

      Once again, you’ve made the mistake of others assuming that Haredim ARE the Orthodox, when they are not. They are not “frum.” They are ultra-frum. I do not hate frum Jews. My animosity is reserved for Haredim, not frum & not Orthodox (at least Haredim are not all of them).

      Palestinian frum minority (the settlers, orthodox, chareidi

      Again, you have absolutely no understanding of the settler movement or mentality. Only a very small minority are there for truly spiritual, & purely religious reasons. Most are there for political reasons & will not remain once they cannot realize those political aspirations in what they call Judea & Samaria. All that will remain are Froman & his followers & a few other stragglers who will assume Palestinian sovereignty. Very few.

      Islamic Palestinian Sumud (صمود‎) is robust enough to celebrate the diversity of its assertive Jewish minority.

      Wow, you not only see into the heart of our settler & Haredi brothers, but also into our Palestinian neighbors as well. What don’t you see & where do you get yr powers? Awesome. I do have a few doubts how you or anyone can know how Palestinians will react to having Jews living within their midst. I’d prefer to take a more cautious approach given the decades of hate & bloodshed bet. our respective peoples & religions. But I understand that you have superior wisdom & vision on these matters & must perforce know the truth in all hearts before the heart itself knows.

      Its a win-win!

      Wow, now you’re a Madison Ave. brand ad copywriter! You know what? I’m going to suggest that this become the slogan for the new Israeli state & maybe even the new Palestinian one as well: It’s a win-win! It has a real winning ring to it, you know? Readers, can we get this translated immediately to Hebrew & Arabic and convey it immediately to the respective powers that be. They assuredly will see the brilliance of this witless slogan and adopt it immediately.

      Not to impose Jewish teachings on you or your Islamic audience

      What? YOU, impose? How could I dream of thinking you might be attempting to impose anything on anyone? Not you.

      The first step toward reconciliation is for you to work on LOVING your settler and chareidi רעה

      Umm, your Excellency, I hope you won’t mind if a make a teensy suggestion that you, um, might be full of, um, crap. I know it’s hard to believe since your intellect has proven so superior in every other instance known to man. But the first step toward solving the conflict is not reconciling with settlers, but reconciling with the true victims, the Palestinians. They need justice, & the Israelis need to offer it to them. Reconciliation with settlers or charedi if it’s necessary will come later. In fact, Israel will have to undergo a massive re-examination of itself & must become a true secular state which will rather distress our Haredi brethren since it will upend their sense of entitlement fr. the State. So rather than reconcile them, I’m afraid it is they who will have to reconicle w. a true secular state which respects all religions including theirs, but does not allow them to determine the destiny of the State.

      frum people (who are significantly more racially homogenous – they tend to be North African…

      More nonsense (God, I’m starting to feel like Shirin lecturing the unwashed about Islam!). I’m talking about Haredim, AGAIN not frum. There are NO Haredim from North Africa.

      calling them “ultra-orthodox” is racist as well

      Now you’ve just proven yrself to be a blithering idiot. Calling Haredim “ultra Orthodox” is racist. OK, I’ve about had it. You’re on the shortest of short leashes. And if you intend to release any future expositions of your wisdom on us I warn you that I will not have any of the patience I’ve shown for you in this reply in future ones.

      I don’t mind ignorance. That I can deal with. But ignorance masked by hubris and undeserved self-confidence is insufferable.

      1. richard,

        you can indeed comment on an entire people without knowing them…but to make rash generalizations in an attempt to belittle them to your readers, is bigotry…plain and simple

        would you allow someone to come on this blog and state, all muslims hate non muslims unless those non muslims were in the process of converting?

        i think not

        1. to make rash generalizations in an attempt to belittle them to your readers, is bigotry

          Bulls(&t. My generalizations are neither rash nor bigoted. In fact that latter word came within a trigger finger of getting you banned here. Use it once more in reference to describing my views & you are toast.

          would you allow someone to come on this blog and state, all muslims hate non muslims unless those non muslims were in the process of converting?

          No I would not, nor is that remotely what I did in the case of Haredim, who once again in case you’ve missed all the tiresome explications I’ve offered before, DO NOT represent all of Judaism, not even all of Orthodox Judaism, but a mere slice of a slice. My dislike for them as a sect is carefully considered & long experienced. I know whereof I speak. And not once has anyone here actually refuted my very specific claims about my disagreements with Haredi Judaism. Not one person has said: No, Richard these guys don’t really hate other Jews who will never become Haredim, they don’t hate non-Jews, they don’t hate Arabs. They’re all soft & cuddly. Even Mr. Sufi peace & love guy didn’t make that claim. So make the claim that what I said about them is wrong & prove it or shut up.

      2. Wow!

        Its heartbreaking to see what a sad, broken, and pathetic person you have become because of your hatred of your Jewish enemies . . .

        Jew-hatred destroyed the formerly glorious Islamic civilization. Its destroying Europe. And look how its destroying you. נבח

        I love you like a brother, and I’d try to talk you down from the ledge. But you don’t seem like the אוהב תוכחה characteristic of most Jews (both progressive and chareidi) that I know.

        Ah, well. I do hope you get counseling and are able to find some genuine happiness in your life. (Given your ethnic background, I’d suggest you look into Judaism. But whatever path you find, I truly pray that you find something that will heal you and your Palestinian nation’s broken soul. And let us together repair the world in Sh-ddai’s Dominion – תיקון עולם במלכות שד-י)

        Good luck with the writing career. And congratulations on the Brass Crescent!

        1. Its heartbreaking to see what a sad, broken, and pathetic person

          No, not sad, not broken & certainly not pathetic. I just can’t stand cant of your particular brand.

          Jew-hatred destroyed the formerly glorious Islamic civilization.

          I have no idea what in tarnation you’re talking about. Islam has absolutely no tradition of “Jew hatred.” You apparently don’t know anything about Islam either though you claim as your website something affiliated with Sufism.

          Its destroying Europe

          What is? Jew hatred? Are you sure you’re in your right mind? What are you talking about?

          I love you like a brother

          Yeah right. People I love I don’t call the names you called me above. You’re a raving hypocrite is what you really are.

          I do hope you get counseling

          And a “concern troll” to boot. How nice to see you exhibit yr particular pathology. This particular little bit of snark is a major comment rule violation (recommending mental treatment for a commenter) here. You’re already moderated so yr next violation will be you booted outa here.

          I’d suggest you look into Judaism

          I’m Jewish and already know more about the tradition than you ever will. So thanks for yr smarminess, but no thanks.

          your Palestinian nation

          You’ve got your national addresses mixed up. I’m not a member of the Palestinian nation.

      3. “Secular Jews are 70% of Israeli Jewish population & you say with 30 yrs they will be a minority?”

        Wake up richard!

        Secular jews are already barely above 50%.

        Most jewish children in israel are haredim.

        Within 20 years secular jews will be a minority here. A couple decades later even non ultra orthodox jews will be a minority.

        Frankley, what the palestinians should do is wait out the jewish state, and once the country collapses in it’s own ignorance they can just swoop in and have it all.

        Haredi demography is by far israel’s greatest problem.

          1. The economy will heal, education can be made better, social and economic gaps can close. Hate can be forgotten, and one way or another, the occupation will end and it probably won’t destroy israel.

            Demography, however, can’t be beaten. It can’t be stopped, and it’s harm cannot be avoided or mitigated. One day, very very soon, we will have a critical mass of haredim. For a few years there will be an israel where people like me can no longer live, and then it will collapse entirely.

            The only way to stop it is to force them to stop reproducing, and that’s not gonna happen.

            So you see, demography is on a whole different level than all our other problems.
            It’s israel’s expiration date, and it’s totally beyond hope.

          2. That will only delay the problem. While the current system makes it easy for them to reproduce in such starteling numbers, haredim are more than willing to continue with their way of life under harsher conditions. They will only change at the very bare minimum that would allow them to survive whil still winning over demography.

  6. Richard,
    I am a regular reader of your blog but I think you overstepped the mark here.
    Ultra-orthodox Judaism attracts troubled people. I’m sure other religions also pick up young, confused – even criminal – people who are looking for an emotionally intense, highly structured community.
    Some of these people have done very well and are stable in their new lives. For example, take the black-hat reggae star Mattisyahu
    It could be that Shyne continues to be a scoundrel. It could also be that he has found a spiritual home. He may also move on – but not back to a violent, criminal life.

    As a general principle, I agree with Shyne that there is nothing in chumash or even talmud against overpriced, Italian cars.

    Bei mir bist du shyne.

    1. there is nothing in chumash or even talmud against overpriced, Italian cars.

      Last I checked not only didn’t Moses drive a high priced Italian sports car, they were not even invented till a few thousand years into the future. And our Prophets tended to inveigh against those Jewish Kings who dallied with the contemporary version of Italian sports cars. Isaiah, Jeremiah & Ezechiel tended not to view such nonsense fondly.

      When you make your first cool million off your cantorial debut album (don’t forget to send a demo to Shyne who I’m sure will promote it for you) you can invite me for a spin in your own personal Lamborghini. Till then I bet both of us are driving more humble models which Isaiah & Jeremiah wouldn’t have as much trouble stomaching.

      1. Shyne referenced “chumash”. As a budding scholar he anticipated your comment: the prophets were famously not for profit.
        I don’t share Shyne’s taste in vehicles, music or religion – but I don’t see in any of those, the portents you found for his future recidivism.

        @ Deir Yassin:
        Thanks for pointing out that “Jamal” is Arabic for “beautiful.” Was “shyne” a wink towards the Yiddish word for beautiful – “shein”?

  7. Not that it’s important, but I read that Shyne’s mother has Jewish roots, and that might have something to do with his new faith. And maybe he wanted to take a radical distance away from his former Arab first name Jama(a)l (‘beautiful’).

    And converts often go for the ‘real thing’ !

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