After mounting an intense DoS attack against this blog and two others in Israel, my web host seems to have figured out a defense against the assault. But now, some members at the Rotter forum, among whose circle this assault may’ve originated, have resorted to homicidal ranting. One poster wrote the following (Hebrew):
I’m in favor of erasing Silverstein from this world at the hands of a Mossad hit squad.
Another member posted a picture of me in the thread. The only thing missing was a bull’s eye. I’m waiting for a Facebook group like the one they prepared for MK Haneen Zoabi calling for hanging her because she joined the Gaza flotilla.
I requested of a Rotter admin that they remove this comment. They have not responded nor have they removed it.
Also, in this thread a member boasts that the YouTube video showing protestors shouting the name of Doron Zahavi during a Sheikh Jarrah demonstration had been attacked and taken down. An Israeli peace activist confirmed the attack. But apparently it failed as the video is there for all the world to see. One thing these juvenile delinquents appear quite good at is cyber-vandalism.
I posted myself to the thread thanking them for their reception. The DoS attack brought my blog to the attention of thousands more Israelis, via stories in Ynet and Maariv, who’d never heard of it till then. A reporter from one of Israel’s major alternative papers spent an hour with me on the phone last night preparing a major profile of me and my blog. As far as I’m concerned they only hurt their own cause through this foolishness. And asking the Mossad to kill me doesn’t do any favors for the reputation of Israel’s overseas spooks either.
One of the common tropes of the Israeli far-right is an obsession with sexual identity and its use to humiliate their enemies. So, the Rotter members delight in claiming my photo is “feminine,” which only reveals their own sense of gender confusion. Frankly, I don’t know what’s more disturbed–their psyches or Israeli policy.
Can there be any doubt in any reasonable person’s mind that this incitement to murder is a symptom of the deep dysfunction within Israel nowadays in which peace activists and human rights NGOs are under physical, verbal and legal attack as never before?
. . . Salute! . . .
Well, you are now ‘the snake’s head’… if you hear some strange humming sound and see a rocket racing towards you, duck and cover 🙂 !
And if I notice any fat balding men in moustaches donning tennis rackets I’ll race in the other direction!
“And can there be any doubt in any reasonable person’s mind that this incitement to murder is a symptom of the deep dysfunction within Israel nowadays in which peace activists and human rights NGOs are under physical, verbal and legal attack as never before?”
Yes Richard, Rotter members represent israeli society as a whole. I am being sarcastic.
Objective,
There is no claim that rotter members represent Israeli society. However, once certain elements in society start issuing death threats to people they dislike while the majority does nothing or sometimes even encourages them, it does point to major problems that unravel the fabric of that society.
And now I suppose, instead of admitting that your sarcasm was a bit pointless here, you will probably want some examples of Israeli society encouraging such acts, wont you?
Are you being sarcastic, objective? You shouldn’t be. Richard has made a very good point, alas, about a society that has become, is becoming, increasingly racist, criminal, and self-denying in flaunting international law and simple decency. Of course, whether right-wing settler or more “ordinary” Israeli citizen, the degree of arrogant lawlessness ranges from indifference to Israel’s actions and attitudes to a murderous support of them. I wish your “being sarcastic” was a wise comment, but I’m afraid it isn’t.
If you don’t think Rotter members are quite representative in many ways of the prevailing attitudes towards civil liberties, Arabs & peace then you don’t know anything about the average Israeli or the current situation in Israel.
on a purely emotional level… i havn’t felt this unsafe since, when i was teenager and a graffiti writer, this gang thought ‘to erase me’. this might not say much to you, but i really do feel that goldtein’s example is a very good example of how the israeli public has become increasingly less tolerant to anybody who’s ‘different’ and poses a threat to the dominant ideology.
“this incitement to murder is a symptom of the deep dysfunction within Israel nowadays ”
“once certain elements in society start issuing death threats to people they dislike while the majority does nothing or sometimes even encourages them, it does point to major problems that unravel the fabric of that society.”
“about a society that has become, is becoming, increasingly racist, criminal, and self-denying in flaunting international law and simple decency. Of course, whether right-wing settler or more “ordinary” Israeli citizen, the degree of arrogant lawlessness ranges from indifference to Israel’s actions and attitudes to a murderous support of them”
You all made my point. You first state yes that your not generalizing but in the end you do.
The proportion Q of the sample has attribute A.
Therefore, the proportion Q of the population has attribute A.
Such a generalization proceeds from a premise about a sample to a conclusion about the population.
Faulty generalization is a mode of thinking that takes knowledge from one group’s or person’s experiences and incorrectly extends it to another.
Person A and Person B walk past a pawn shop. Person A remarks that a watch in a window display looks like the one his grandfather used to wear. On the basis of this remark, Person B concludes that:
Person A’s grandfather pawned his watch; or
Person A’s grandfather had expensive tastes in jewelry; or
Person A’s grandfather was ostentatious; or
Person A’s grandfather cannot tell the time any more.
If that doesn’t clarify lets take a simple example.
Islamophobia: Muslims are wrongly critisized that because they are not doing enough to combat extreme jihadists or modifying Norman’s words whether right-wing extremist or more “ordinary” muslim, the degree of arrogant lawlessness ranges from indifference to terrorist actions in the name of Islam and attitudes to a murderous support of them.
Just because of some idiots are giving death sentences doesn’t mean that israelis are to blame. If that is not generalizing than what is. As same as in islamophobia.
Islam is entirely different than Israel. Israel is a country with a government which has national policies and pursues an illegal Occupation. The gov’t & military act in the name of the Israeli people. As such, Israel can & should be held accountable for those acts under international law.
Islam has no government, no political policy. It is a religion with hundreds of millions of adherents scattered across the globe. You cannot say that Islam believes this or that since there is no monolithic Islam & no one speaks on behalf of the entire religion unlike Israel where there is a government & political leader who do so.
“And now I suppose, instead of admitting that your sarcasm was a bit pointless here, you will probably want some examples of Israeli society encouraging such acts, wont you?”
I can give you examples from US that israel is not the only country where group of stupid people encourage and incite hate towards minorities and demonstrators. Same thing in Europe. Does that mean that because the majority doesn’t speak outloud against these instances they are to be blamed.
If so, then we all are to blame.
Objective,
The ostrich routine isn’t working here. When we speak of the majority’s silence on this matter, we mostly mean the government. There are plenty of examples:
1. The revocation of MK Zouabi’s rights as a member of Knesset. Seeing as she has not broken any law and even if she has, it is covered under the immunity act. That is a sign of the majority passing legislation to shut up the minority.
2. The citizenship temporary (i.e. permanent) act which forbids Israeli Arabs from marrying anyone from the territories and living in Israel.
3. Demonstrators against the disengagement plan are briefly arrested and released and then quickly pardoned by an act of parliament. Demonstrators against the settlements in Sheikh Jarrah are attacked and brutalized by the police, and then arrested despite a clear court order specifying that the demonstration is legal.
4. The state and army completely disregarding a court ruling that the wall in Bil’in is illegal and continue to harass, attack and sometimes kill demonstrators who demand nothing more than that the ruling be upheld.
I could go on and on really, the list is endless. The point that I am trying to make is that all the decisions above have been cheered on by the rotter boys and their kind, despite of them being racist, discriminatory and wholly illegal.
Way to go, Richard. A forced look in the mirror, but the rotters can’t take the truth.
I suggest you read your comments first before you start correcting them. I show you what I mean about that:
“When we speak of the majority’s silence on this matter, we mostly mean the government.”
Okay, well this is what you wrote before:
“However, once certain elements in society start issuing death threats to people they dislike while the majority does nothing or sometimes even encourages them, it does point to major problems that unravel the fabric of that society.”
Now what wording is “mostly mean the government”. majority does nothing or sometimes even encourages them or unravel the fabric of society. Neither one fits in your government statement. You clearly refer the majority as the people of israel, the citizens. fabric of society does not equal to government.
Maybe you ment Normans comment as the government: quote “society that has become”. Nope not referring to any government. quote “whether right-wing settler or more “ordinary” Israeli citizen”, clearly points out to average joe and not the government.
Your shooting yourself in the foot Ariel.
Objective, nice try but the nitpicking isn’t working here. I’ll refer you to the famous quote by judge Louis D. Brandeis:
“The government is the potent omnipresent teacher. For good or ill it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a lawbreaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy.”
Point is, in a democracy, the government is usually elected by the majority and represents the majority. There are however exceptions to that rule. Sometimes public demonstrations are large enough to sway the government. Therefore, “…mostly mean the government” but not always.
Once the government representing the majority starts systematically breaking the law, society begins to fall apart. A situation that is referred to as “The Slippery Slope” or “The Greasy Pole”. In order to stop the slide, the majority of the people must elect a different government, or speak out against what is happening. If they don’t, the situation worsens.
I don’t claim that the rotter boys are the majority in Israel, I don’t think they they even all vote for the same party. I do claim that the sentiment that prevails in that forum is reflected in the views of other groups and political parties. For example – Im Tirtzu’s smear campaign against the New Israel Fund, the proposed legislation to outlaw any calls to boycott Israel and specifically settlement produce. The violent language and death threats directed towards lefties and arabs in the forum (nothing new really, been hearing it in demonstrations for years) is reflected in MK’s allowing themselves to physically assault MK Zouabi. You can see it in the “Price Tag” pogroms carried out by settlers who are never arrested (not even the poor pogromchik who got his skull cracked open when the villagers defended themselves).
So – My foot is fine, thank you. Do you plan to make a point here or do you wish to argue about the location of the greasy pole or the type of grease used on it?
ariel when you forming a argument make sure your past comments fits that argument. Now you are modifying what u said before. Nothing in your present comment or in this rotter member writing comes even close to your past 2 statements.
You are talking about two different subjects. do you find me contradicting any of your previous statements? I am talking about oranges and you apples. You should of said in the first place what your point is.
I don’t got energy to change the topping now. We can debate some other time how democracies are disfuctioning all around the world. I can tell you some other time stories from Europe and its perfect democracies.
This is getting old fast. Could you please move on to another subject & another thread.
im still kinda confused as to what you did
you gave out a name of a person holding a public position
big deal
I revealed the actual identity of an accused IDF military intelligence torturer.
Your headline of a previous thread says “Identity of form IDF torturer exposed”. Do you know that for a fact? Was he convicted in court? Or did you mean “suspected torturer”? Otherwise you were being judge and jury. That is a pretty serious allegation…. do you really feel it is your job to go publicizing things like this around the world if there is no concrete proof, only accusations?
He’s a torturer even by his own lying account of the incident. Here’s what HE claimed happened. He sent one of his officers into Dirani’s cell in his underpants & told Dirani he would rape him if he didn’t talk. I’m sorry my friend, but that is torture & abuse even at that level. If I take a gun and put it to your head & tell you I’m going to pull the trigger but don’t, that’s torture.
But to be clear, I don’t even believe Zahavi’s claim. I believe Dirani’s. And the IDF has a perfectly credible way to prove that Dirani is lying. It can have a doctor examine Dirani to say whether or not he was sodomized. Did they do that? What do you think? If you don’t then it’s because the truth is much closer to Dirani than Zahavi.
Dirani sued Zahavi & Zahavi tried unsuccessfully to get the case quashed. The only thing that rendered the case moot was that Israel agreed to a prisoner swap that released Dirani. Since he is no longer in Israel the case is in abeyance (but not dropped). Further, the IDF sacked Zahavi & closed the secret torture facility where this happened. Do YOU think the IDF would do such things if he wasn’t guilty? You tell me.
Boo hoo…the only incitements to murder you don’t believe in are those of Hamas and Ahmadinejad. Just sayin’.
I have idea what this means.
I agree with you 100%! Israeli society is in decay. There is generalized apathy and distorted perception: black is white and down is up to them.
Please be safe, but don’t allow these goons to threaten you into silence. Please keep on speaking the truth. There are other bloggers expressing the same views you express. You are not alone and these bullies know it.
I hope the growing outcry against Israeli injustice irritates them to no end! You blog is one of the best on the subject.
We have also been having problems …
See:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2010/aug/06/digg-investigates-claims-conservative-censorship
At first sight, less extreme than Rotters, but these people have a strategy that has been working up till now and actually affecting what information we see.
As for Rotter.net: pathological liars are one of the most sadistic forms of psychopath there is. So beware anyone who tries to force you to accept untruths, because they will turn violent in the end. They are not merely compelled to tell lies, they are compelled to force people to believe things which are not only untrue, but which cannot be true. A fist is violence directed at my face, a lie is violence directed at the core of my being.
In theory, this should link directly to one of the RELEVANT comments, on the article about comments being used to manipulate opinion…
http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2010/aug/06/digg-investigates-claims-conservative-censorship?showallcomments=true#CommentKey:40bb6c28-d0d7-4317-aaf5-b896bc9a4dcc
Yes, it does. A Guardian gadget and it works!
One of the comments mentions some software called “Megaphone” which is apparently intended for this kind of organized trolling. Someone meets every need.
Could that be what was running the other weekend?
This is what they mean by “Megaphone”.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megaphone_desktop_tool
That could explain all the hits on my blog within seconds of my reproducing the material Richard was being DoS attacked over. May experiment with a voting box and see what happens. Someone needs to market an App that detects this and automatically publishes every Megaphoned IP.
I’d read this as: “I wish RS was dead”. This is not really a death threat, though it’s surely unpleasant to read.
Forgive me, I don’t parse such statements. Anything that has “dead” and my name in it is a death threat. Death wish & death threat are interchangeable for me. Let me see you face the same personally & react any differently.
Richard, you are dead right about it 😉
And, as the sentence above proves, you aren’t 🙂
But I agree with you – it must be very unpleasant to be on the receiving side of such “wishes”.
Once again, as I’m NOT in such a position, and hence can keep a cooler head: This is nothing more than some kid blowing steam (if that’s correct English). Nothing you should worry about.
Thanks I won’t. And the proper idiom is “blowing OFF steam.” “Blowin’ steam” without adding “off” makes it appear the kid has steam pouring out of his ears, a funny image. But that’s a really interesting saying & for the life of me I can’t figure out where it came from or how it came to mean what it does mean except that “steam” has a sense of anger and blowing off steam would mean releasing anger, I guess.
My above correction is meant entirely constructively.