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17 Responses to “Yossi Melman on Y., Shabak Secrecy and Tikun Olam”

1. iris says:

   August 26, 2010 at 4:46 AM

   Again, being lenient on those who betray their vocation, because “its comlicated” is not helpful IMHO, to the contrary.
   If people dont stand up, at least they can do the honest thing, and that’s to admit publicly in writing that they are not free to do their job. If that’s impossible, than you are accepting the unacceptable from a patronizing position.

   I deserve honest journalists, and so do all other Israelis. Instead we get “pravda” coates as “free press”. The Melmans are not less responsible than the generals to our condition. its a tango they are dancing.

   Reply
   • A Zionist says:

     August 26, 2010 at 6:04 AM

     [comment deleted & commenter banned for violating site comment rules

     Reply
   • fiddler says:

     August 26, 2010 at 7:49 AM

     If people dont stand up, at least they can do the honest thing, and that’s to admit publicly in writing that they are not free to do their job.

     Isn’t that just what Melman has done at the end of the excerpt quoted by Richard?
     If you’re saying journalists aren’t either challenging or at least naming-and-shaming censorship often enough, then I’m all on board. But why bash the rare reporter who gets it right for a change?

     Reply
     • Richard Silverstein says:

       August 26, 2010 at 3:29 PM

       Yes, you’re right. That is precisely what Melman has done. He’s said he’s dying to report on this but his hands are tied. If we blame anyone it’s the publishers who aren’t willing to challenge the status quo enough & get sued or be threatened w. the loss of their publishing license. THough that too is a dangerous game.

       Reply
   • Ronen says:

     August 26, 2010 at 8:36 AM

     you mean Pravda like the translated version of the author ?
     who states “here is usually a grain of truth, if a few speculations as well.”

     while the Hebrew version states “עם לא מעט ספקולציות”

     which if one would translate it to English should be “with more then few speculations as well”

     Reply
     • Richard Silverstein says:

       August 26, 2010 at 2:59 PM

       Yours is a mistranslation as well. A literal translation would be “with not a few speculations.”

       THis will be yr last comment due to identity fraud & sock puppetry.

       Reply
   • duck says:

     August 26, 2010 at 12:08 PM

     But it is complicated. Firstly, because most israelis and many journalists WANT pravda. Those that do see the veil of censorship have no one to expose it TO. Secondly, it’s always been this way. When soethong like anat kam happens they raise a racket, but otherwise they just accept the given situation.

     Reply
     • iris says:

       August 27, 2010 at 4:24 AM

       i agree.
       i dislike the credit and praise though, that some journos solicit, which they do not merit. I feel that this schmoozing here is helping to keep the status quo. Not that I have suggestions…

       Reply
2. Shunra says:

   August 26, 2010 at 7:09 AM

   He sounds jealous – and what irks me is that he’s putting you down: he called you an “international bulletin board”, which implies that your inquiries, fact-checking, etc., are somehow less valid than his.

   I read it as part of the panic reigning among print journalists in response to the death of print. Responding with panic and put-downs seems to threaten his livelihood (and my respect for him) more than the death of print, though.

   Reply
   • Vicky says:

     August 26, 2010 at 9:31 AM

     I don’t get the impression that he is putting Tikkun Olam down. Perhaps I’m missing some subtlety or other, but to me ‘bulletin board’ just makes it sound like a place where lots of people can go to share information. It also seems to be a way of pointing his readership towards the blog – “I’m not allowed to say XYZ, but if you want to read about it, visit here.”

     I agree that print journalists generally do tend to look down on bloggers for the very reason that you describe, but I’m not sure whether that always holds true in a place like Israel. The blogger’s freedom to write what he likes may look more desirable than the ‘prestige’ of writing pieces for a paper that is prohibited from reporting on so many things.

     Reply
     • Shunra says:

       August 26, 2010 at 12:04 PM

       Thanks, Vicky, that is indeed a better way of seeing things.

       Thanks!

       Reply
   • Richard Silverstein says:

     August 26, 2010 at 3:28 PM

     There is a bit of that going on. I don’t think anyone at Haaretz can afford to acknowledge I’m getting stories they should be publishing. A way to compensate is to somehow diminish me, though Melman didn’t do that as sniffily as some in the MSM do.

     The ENglish language translation of his article contains even more sniffiness. Since Haaretz writers have nothing to do w. such translation I can only guess an editor or translator tried to make me look a tad worse than the original version. They added the phrase “half truth” which isn’t in the original. I didn’t take too kindly to that.

     Reply
3. Roy says:

   August 26, 2010 at 12:58 PM

   Those kind of posts just reveal who you really are, Richard.
   You’re a publicity seeking whistle-blower wannabe who has a huge inferiority complex. And you think that just because you have a couple of blog entries and a couple of supposed reliable ‘Israeli’ friends, you’ll be granted eventually as an important person and people will finally give a damn about you.
   You tried to spread your rhetoric in big and important Israeli forums, and quickly ran with your tail between your legs.. Not because you were granted with insults, but because no one took you seriously.
   In fact, no one with a right mind actually takes you seriously.
   You can only fool yourself, and some others who are like you.
   I’d love to get a response, but you’ll probably won’t do it and will delete this message and ban its poster.
   You only support freedom of speech and the likes when it fits your agenda.
   That’s what makes you such an hypocrite, and that’s why people don’t take you seriously.

   Cheers

   Reply
   • Richard Silverstein says:

     August 26, 2010 at 2:57 PM

     You tried to spread your rhetoric in big and important Israeli forums, and quickly ran with your tail between your legs

     The nastier you people are the higher my standing among my readers & the more new readers you attract. The fact of the matter is that my work is still quoted & linked extensively at the most popular Israeli online forum, Rotter, which in turn draws a large amt of site traffic fr those who want to know what Israeli authorities won’t let them know.

     I was banned by Fresh, a less popular forum & was never given any reason for being banned. The same types of material were posted at both sites.

     So I never ran anywhere & don’t have a tail to hide bet. my legs (though perhaps that’s part of yr anatomy & you’re confusing me w. you).

     I’m afraid to say that Yossi Melman takes my work seriously & I’d rather have his regard than 1,000 of you.

     Reply
4. Sol Salbe says:

   August 26, 2010 at 1:13 PM

   An update on the Israeli Chelem. The military censor contacted a blog that I follow which had an extensive coverage of this story (as well as a few laudatory comments about this blog.) They very politely asked the blogger to remove Y’s name. Blogger wisely complied but left the link so anybody can still read it here. [As if there are any Internet-savvy Hebrew readers who cannot read English. Chelem.

   Reply
   • Shunra says:

     August 26, 2010 at 1:16 PM

     I think we have found the true enemy of the Shabak: Israelis. The identity of its leader MUST be kept safe from them…

     ::headdesk::

     Reply
5. DICKERSON3870 says:

   August 26, 2010 at 5:53 PM

   RE: “…claims he knows the identity of Y., deputy director of the Shabak…” – Melman
   MY COMMENT: “Y.”? How Kafkaesque! Quite reminiscent of “K.”! And not by coincidence, I’m guessing.

   Reply