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	<title>Comments on: Seattle&#8217;s Leading Rabbi Supports Violent Overthrow of Iranian Regime</title>
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	<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2009/10/22/seattles-leading-rabbi-supports-violent-overthrow-of-iranian-regime/</link>
	<description>Essays on politics, culture and ideas about Israeli-Arab peace and world music</description>
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		<title>By: Richard Silverstein</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2009/10/22/seattles-leading-rabbi-supports-violent-overthrow-of-iranian-regime/comment-page-1/#comment-115486</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Silverstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 08:31:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/?p=8835#comment-115486</guid>
		<description>Yes, buckets of tears.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, buckets of tears.</p>
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		<title>By: Shirin</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2009/10/22/seattles-leading-rabbi-supports-violent-overthrow-of-iranian-regime/comment-page-1/#comment-115484</link>
		<dc:creator>Shirin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 06:46:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/?p=8835#comment-115484</guid>
		<description>&quot;&lt;i&gt;Iran lacks any of the reviews, analyses, judgments, soul-searching, military ethics...&lt;/i&gt;&quot;

1. Rabbi, how do you know what Iran lacks and does not lack in that regard. In fact, all you have to go on is assumptions based solely on propaganda that you clearly have not fact-checked.

2. Given that Iran has almost no need of a military, has not used its military since the &#039;80&#039;s, and has not been involved in a war of aggression for nearly three centuries, it is difficult to see how &quot;military ethics&quot; are even relevant here. Iran&#039;s military is very small relative to the size and population of the country, and its military budget is minuscule compared to that of the countries that are pretending to quake in fear of the &quot;Iran threat&quot;.

&quot;&lt;i&gt;it is Israel, at least as much as the Palestinians, that never misses an opportunity to miss an opportunity.&lt;/i&gt;&quot;

It is not only that the above description applies to Israel far more than to the Palestinians. Israel does not merely never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity, Israel never misses an opportunity to give the middle finger to an opportunity. As only one example, the Arab League has, for eight years running now, unanimously reaffirmed its official offer to Israel of everything Israel claims it wants - peace, recognition, and full diplomatic and economic relations. All Israel has to do in return is comply with international law by withdrawing from the Occupied Territories, leave the Palestinians free to form their state in the OPT, and come to a mutually-agreed-upon resolution to the refugee problem. For eight years Israel&#039;s response has been a refusal to even consider this most generous offer as a starting point for negotiations. The entire Arab world has offered Israel peace, and more, on a silver platter, and Israel projects its middle finger at the offer. That fact, more than any other, tells us exactly how high a priority Israel really places on peace. 

&quot;&lt;i&gt;The Gaza withdrawal was not a gift to Hamas.&lt;/i&gt;&quot;

The Gaza withdrawal was also not an end to the occupation, as the hasbarists would have us believe. The fact that the colonies were dismantled and the military withdrawn does not change the fact that Gaza is still occupied territory held under Israeli control.

&quot;&lt;i&gt;I blame the corrupt leadership of Fatah and the intransigent leadership of Hamas blahblahblah...&lt;/i&gt;&quot;

Standard blame-the-victims drivel. With all due respect, Rabbi, you forgot to mention how unconscionable it is that the Palestinians force the Israelis to slaughter their children, and destroy their homes, and fields, and businesses, and uproot their olive trees. I mean, how dare they be so cruel to the poor Israelis?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;<i>Iran lacks any of the reviews, analyses, judgments, soul-searching, military ethics&#8230;</i>&#8221;</p>
<p>1. Rabbi, how do you know what Iran lacks and does not lack in that regard. In fact, all you have to go on is assumptions based solely on propaganda that you clearly have not fact-checked.</p>
<p>2. Given that Iran has almost no need of a military, has not used its military since the &#8217;80&#8242;s, and has not been involved in a war of aggression for nearly three centuries, it is difficult to see how &#8220;military ethics&#8221; are even relevant here. Iran&#8217;s military is very small relative to the size and population of the country, and its military budget is minuscule compared to that of the countries that are pretending to quake in fear of the &#8220;Iran threat&#8221;.</p>
<p>&#8220;<i>it is Israel, at least as much as the Palestinians, that never misses an opportunity to miss an opportunity.</i>&#8221;</p>
<p>It is not only that the above description applies to Israel far more than to the Palestinians. Israel does not merely never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity, Israel never misses an opportunity to give the middle finger to an opportunity. As only one example, the Arab League has, for eight years running now, unanimously reaffirmed its official offer to Israel of everything Israel claims it wants &#8211; peace, recognition, and full diplomatic and economic relations. All Israel has to do in return is comply with international law by withdrawing from the Occupied Territories, leave the Palestinians free to form their state in the OPT, and come to a mutually-agreed-upon resolution to the refugee problem. For eight years Israel&#8217;s response has been a refusal to even consider this most generous offer as a starting point for negotiations. The entire Arab world has offered Israel peace, and more, on a silver platter, and Israel projects its middle finger at the offer. That fact, more than any other, tells us exactly how high a priority Israel really places on peace. </p>
<p>&#8220;<i>The Gaza withdrawal was not a gift to Hamas.</i>&#8221;</p>
<p>The Gaza withdrawal was also not an end to the occupation, as the hasbarists would have us believe. The fact that the colonies were dismantled and the military withdrawn does not change the fact that Gaza is still occupied territory held under Israeli control.</p>
<p>&#8220;<i>I blame the corrupt leadership of Fatah and the intransigent leadership of Hamas blahblahblah&#8230;</i>&#8221;</p>
<p>Standard blame-the-victims drivel. With all due respect, Rabbi, you forgot to mention how unconscionable it is that the Palestinians force the Israelis to slaughter their children, and destroy their homes, and fields, and businesses, and uproot their olive trees. I mean, how dare they be so cruel to the poor Israelis?</p>
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		<title>By: Shirin</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2009/10/22/seattles-leading-rabbi-supports-violent-overthrow-of-iranian-regime/comment-page-1/#comment-115483</link>
		<dc:creator>Shirin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 05:09:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/?p=8835#comment-115483</guid>
		<description>&quot;&lt;i&gt;the IDF is the most moral army in the world, investigates itself, engages in deep soul searching.&lt;/i&gt;&quot;

Ah yes! The IDF shoots, cries, shoots again, cries again, shoots still more, and cries some more. Israel is the most self-pitying army in the world.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;<i>the IDF is the most moral army in the world, investigates itself, engages in deep soul searching.</i>&#8221;</p>
<p>Ah yes! The IDF shoots, cries, shoots again, cries again, shoots still more, and cries some more. Israel is the most self-pitying army in the world.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Silverstein</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2009/10/22/seattles-leading-rabbi-supports-violent-overthrow-of-iranian-regime/comment-page-1/#comment-115480</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Silverstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 04:47:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/?p=8835#comment-115480</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;it is disingenuous and inaccurate to compare the tyrannical theocracy of Iran to the democratic, pluralistic government of Israel&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Iran is a democracy.  A flawed democracy (obviously after the June elections) but it is a democracy.  Israel too is a flawed democracy.  In fact, it isn&#039;t really a democracy, but an ethnocracy since it offer superior rights to one ethnic group over another.  Also, to call Israel &quot;pluralistic&quot; in the sense you do is inaccurate since Israel barely tolerates its minorities (not unlike Iran btw).

&lt;blockquote&gt;inclusive of the territories.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Now this is rich.  You&#039;re claiming that Palestinian life under Occupation is freer, more democratic and pluralistic than life in Iran?  Is that what you really are claiming?  I know scores of Palestinians who are actually living life under Occupation who would eagerly dispute you.  You, unlike them, know nothing about life under Occupation.  Nor do you know anything about life in Iran.  I would actually urge you to visit Iran, which despite difficult conditions is open to Americans to visit.  In fact, I know an Iranian American who organizes such trips and would consider attempting to include you in a tour.  I doubt you&#039;d be willing to do so though.  You&#039;d prefer to rail against the Iran than actually visit the country and see it face to face.

&lt;blockquote&gt;Iran lacks any of the reviews, analyses, judgments, soul-searching, military ethics and internal findings favoring the Palestinians that are the normative course in Israel’s deliberations.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Ah yes, the IDF is the most moral army in the world, investigates itself, engages in deep soul searching.  Really, are you still living in 1967?  What country are you talking about?  Do you know what&#039;s gone on in Israel since 1967?  How can any intelligent Jewish person say the things you have &amp; ignore massacre and mayhem in Lebanon &amp; Gaza (regardless of whatever provocation Israel faced before engaging in these massacres)?  Do pls. explain to us what soul searching Israel has engaged in in the aftermath of the Gaza war?  Point us to the independent investigatory commission appointed by the gov&#039;t to review the killings of hundreds of unarmed Gaza civilians by the IDF.

&lt;blockquote&gt;the Palestinians never pass up an opportunity to pass up an opportunity.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
More tired irrelevant propaganda circa 1967.  I&#039;m afraid it is Israel, at least as much as the Palestinians, that never misses an opportunity to miss an opportunity.

&lt;blockquote&gt;The scoffed at a state on a silver platter at Camp David in 2000&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Now you&#039;re spouting Ehud Barak&#039;s propaganda about Arafat passing up a Palestinian state at Camp David.  Apparently, you haven&#039;t read books of people who were there like Aaron David Miller &amp; Clayton Swisher which present a far diff. picture.  The Palestinians scoffed at a deal they couldn&#039;t sell to their own people that didn&#039;t offer a full return to 67 borders.

&lt;blockquote&gt;they were given Gaza by the most right of Israeli governments&lt;/blockquote&gt;
The Sharon gov&#039;t was by far not &quot;the most right of Israeli governments,&quot; unless you exclude the governments of Yitzchak Shamir &amp; Netanyahu who preceeded him.  Not to mention Menachem Begin.  The Gaza withdrawal was not a gift to Hamas.  Israel left unilaterally making no attempt to negotiate its withdrawal with the Palestinians and getting nothing in return for it.  It was one of the stupidest &amp; most disastrous policy blunders the Israelis have ever made.  And it&#039;s no wonder that Gazans didn&#039;t see the withdrawal as a peace gesture, but rather as an act of desperation, resignation &amp; defeat on the part of the Sharon gov&#039;t.  Peace doesn&#039;t come through unilateral withdrawals.  It comes through bilateral negotiations.

&lt;blockquote&gt;the unprovoked attacks of Hezbollah in 2006&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Let&#039;s examine yet another pro-Israel hasbara meme you offer here.  Do you say that hundreds of Hezbollah prisoners in Israeli jails w Israel keeping those prisoners imprisoned indefinitely w/o trial is not grounds for Hezbollah to feel justified in attacking Israel?  Would you say that unresolved land disputes between Israel and Lebanon in which Israel held territory that Israel itself conceded was NOT Israeli, was not suitable grounds for Hezbollah to feel justified in attacking Israel?  So while I do not justify any act of violence against Israel, to say that the Hezbollah attacks were &quot;unprovoked&quot; shows once again that you have little grasp for some of the subjects on which you expound.

&lt;blockquote&gt;I blame the corrupt leadership of Fatah and the intransigent leadership of Hamas for their criminal negligence of the suffering of their own people.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Yes, yes, we know how this song goes, the words place all blame squarely on the shoulders of the Palestinians while Israel is white as snow.  It&#039;s an old, tired song that most people stopped singing long ago.  But you carry on despite everything that has changed since the song was a hit so long ago.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>it is disingenuous and inaccurate to compare the tyrannical theocracy of Iran to the democratic, pluralistic government of Israel</p></blockquote>
<p>Iran is a democracy.  A flawed democracy (obviously after the June elections) but it is a democracy.  Israel too is a flawed democracy.  In fact, it isn&#8217;t really a democracy, but an ethnocracy since it offer superior rights to one ethnic group over another.  Also, to call Israel &#8220;pluralistic&#8221; in the sense you do is inaccurate since Israel barely tolerates its minorities (not unlike Iran btw).</p>
<blockquote><p>inclusive of the territories.</p></blockquote>
<p>Now this is rich.  You&#8217;re claiming that Palestinian life under Occupation is freer, more democratic and pluralistic than life in Iran?  Is that what you really are claiming?  I know scores of Palestinians who are actually living life under Occupation who would eagerly dispute you.  You, unlike them, know nothing about life under Occupation.  Nor do you know anything about life in Iran.  I would actually urge you to visit Iran, which despite difficult conditions is open to Americans to visit.  In fact, I know an Iranian American who organizes such trips and would consider attempting to include you in a tour.  I doubt you&#8217;d be willing to do so though.  You&#8217;d prefer to rail against the Iran than actually visit the country and see it face to face.</p>
<blockquote><p>Iran lacks any of the reviews, analyses, judgments, soul-searching, military ethics and internal findings favoring the Palestinians that are the normative course in Israel’s deliberations.</p></blockquote>
<p>Ah yes, the IDF is the most moral army in the world, investigates itself, engages in deep soul searching.  Really, are you still living in 1967?  What country are you talking about?  Do you know what&#8217;s gone on in Israel since 1967?  How can any intelligent Jewish person say the things you have &#038; ignore massacre and mayhem in Lebanon &#038; Gaza (regardless of whatever provocation Israel faced before engaging in these massacres)?  Do pls. explain to us what soul searching Israel has engaged in in the aftermath of the Gaza war?  Point us to the independent investigatory commission appointed by the gov&#8217;t to review the killings of hundreds of unarmed Gaza civilians by the IDF.</p>
<blockquote><p>the Palestinians never pass up an opportunity to pass up an opportunity.</p></blockquote>
<p>More tired irrelevant propaganda circa 1967.  I&#8217;m afraid it is Israel, at least as much as the Palestinians, that never misses an opportunity to miss an opportunity.</p>
<blockquote><p>The scoffed at a state on a silver platter at Camp David in 2000</p></blockquote>
<p>Now you&#8217;re spouting Ehud Barak&#8217;s propaganda about Arafat passing up a Palestinian state at Camp David.  Apparently, you haven&#8217;t read books of people who were there like Aaron David Miller &#038; Clayton Swisher which present a far diff. picture.  The Palestinians scoffed at a deal they couldn&#8217;t sell to their own people that didn&#8217;t offer a full return to 67 borders.</p>
<blockquote><p>they were given Gaza by the most right of Israeli governments</p></blockquote>
<p>The Sharon gov&#8217;t was by far not &#8220;the most right of Israeli governments,&#8221; unless you exclude the governments of Yitzchak Shamir &#038; Netanyahu who preceeded him.  Not to mention Menachem Begin.  The Gaza withdrawal was not a gift to Hamas.  Israel left unilaterally making no attempt to negotiate its withdrawal with the Palestinians and getting nothing in return for it.  It was one of the stupidest &#038; most disastrous policy blunders the Israelis have ever made.  And it&#8217;s no wonder that Gazans didn&#8217;t see the withdrawal as a peace gesture, but rather as an act of desperation, resignation &#038; defeat on the part of the Sharon gov&#8217;t.  Peace doesn&#8217;t come through unilateral withdrawals.  It comes through bilateral negotiations.</p>
<blockquote><p>the unprovoked attacks of Hezbollah in 2006</p></blockquote>
<p>Let&#8217;s examine yet another pro-Israel hasbara meme you offer here.  Do you say that hundreds of Hezbollah prisoners in Israeli jails w Israel keeping those prisoners imprisoned indefinitely w/o trial is not grounds for Hezbollah to feel justified in attacking Israel?  Would you say that unresolved land disputes between Israel and Lebanon in which Israel held territory that Israel itself conceded was NOT Israeli, was not suitable grounds for Hezbollah to feel justified in attacking Israel?  So while I do not justify any act of violence against Israel, to say that the Hezbollah attacks were &#8220;unprovoked&#8221; shows once again that you have little grasp for some of the subjects on which you expound.</p>
<blockquote><p>I blame the corrupt leadership of Fatah and the intransigent leadership of Hamas for their criminal negligence of the suffering of their own people.</p></blockquote>
<p>Yes, yes, we know how this song goes, the words place all blame squarely on the shoulders of the Palestinians while Israel is white as snow.  It&#8217;s an old, tired song that most people stopped singing long ago.  But you carry on despite everything that has changed since the song was a hit so long ago.</p>
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		<title>By: Warren</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2009/10/22/seattles-leading-rabbi-supports-violent-overthrow-of-iranian-regime/comment-page-1/#comment-115473</link>
		<dc:creator>Warren</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 01:49:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/?p=8835#comment-115473</guid>
		<description>Rabbi Weiner, regarding the occupied territories, nice job blaming the Palestinian victims---pretty unseemly for a spiritual leader to stoop so low.  I suppose concerning the 300 Palestinian children slaughtered by the IDF, it was their fault, they had it coming, right?  

I&#039;m just curious, do you see anything in your mandate and calling as a rabbi beyond tribal cheerleading and ethnic nationalism, because I frankly don&#039;t get the sense you embrace the whole of humanity beyond your own people?  Granted, I come from a different faith tradition, but my understanding has always been that a spiritual leader is compelled to speak to the universal when it comes to peace, justice, understanding, and the like.  

You provide no indication that you have any sort universalist framework of looking at the world, which I always thought was at least implicit in the major world religions as well as stemming from the Enlightenment tradition.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rabbi Weiner, regarding the occupied territories, nice job blaming the Palestinian victims&#8212;pretty unseemly for a spiritual leader to stoop so low.  I suppose concerning the 300 Palestinian children slaughtered by the IDF, it was their fault, they had it coming, right?  </p>
<p>I&#8217;m just curious, do you see anything in your mandate and calling as a rabbi beyond tribal cheerleading and ethnic nationalism, because I frankly don&#8217;t get the sense you embrace the whole of humanity beyond your own people?  Granted, I come from a different faith tradition, but my understanding has always been that a spiritual leader is compelled to speak to the universal when it comes to peace, justice, understanding, and the like.  </p>
<p>You provide no indication that you have any sort universalist framework of looking at the world, which I always thought was at least implicit in the major world religions as well as stemming from the Enlightenment tradition.</p>
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		<title>By: Shirin</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2009/10/22/seattles-leading-rabbi-supports-violent-overthrow-of-iranian-regime/comment-page-1/#comment-115456</link>
		<dc:creator>Shirin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Oct 2009 07:10:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/?p=8835#comment-115456</guid>
		<description>&quot;&lt;i&gt;life in a medieval theocracy &lt;/i&gt;&quot;

Rabbi Weiner, how much time have you spent in Iran? None would be my guess. Oddly enough, no one I know who has spent time there would ever describe it as a &quot;medieval theocracy&quot; or anything close to that, and I myself certainly would not.

I am afraid you have drunk too much of the Kool Aid served up by the anti-Iran cult, and it has interfered with what must otherwise be a very good mind.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;<i>life in a medieval theocracy </i>&#8221;</p>
<p>Rabbi Weiner, how much time have you spent in Iran? None would be my guess. Oddly enough, no one I know who has spent time there would ever describe it as a &#8220;medieval theocracy&#8221; or anything close to that, and I myself certainly would not.</p>
<p>I am afraid you have drunk too much of the Kool Aid served up by the anti-Iran cult, and it has interfered with what must otherwise be a very good mind.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Silverstein</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2009/10/22/seattles-leading-rabbi-supports-violent-overthrow-of-iranian-regime/comment-page-1/#comment-115451</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Silverstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Oct 2009 06:26:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/?p=8835#comment-115451</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;The aggregate of the articles I’ve cited indisputably attest to both the Shah’s regime and the Khomeini revolution as bloody and detestable.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Until this comment you just published you hadn&#039;t said a word about the Shah &amp; your high moral dudgeon seemed reserved only for the Iranian Revolution.  At least you concede there was evil that preceed it.  Though of course you haven&#039;t connected the two in a way that shows that the bloodiness of the Shah&#039;s regime led directly to the bloodiness of the Revolution.

Second, you didn&#039;t just call the Iranian regime &quot;bloody &amp; detestable&quot; which is a phrase I would generally accept unless it was being used in the form you are to justify war against it.  You called the regime one of the greatest evils of our generation and said Iranians were &quot;enslaved by unqualified evil.&quot;  The term&#039;s &quot;detestable&quot; &amp; &quot;unqualified evil&quot; are quite different.

I find it interesting that you&#039;re attempting to argue that the Shah&#039;s rule was superior to the current government.  The only Iranians who share this view are the monarchists.  Are you one?  I also find it interesting that you, living here in Seattle, knowing very little about Iran as a country, its culture, language or even religion have decided it is a &quot;medieval theocracy&quot; when Iranians I know, all of whom dislike the Islamic Republic immensely and wish to see it replaced, heartily disagree with you.  One think I strongly urge is that you attempt to use a bit of nuance in yr judgments &amp; language.  It is very easy to get into high moral dudgeon and speak in slogans rather than depict reality.

&lt;blockquote&gt;Mehdi Karroubi, who has spoken publicly condemning the current regime as “worse than the Shah.”&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Yet even someone who says the current regime is worse than the Shah does NOT support its violent overthrow as you do.  In fact, he hasn&#039;t even attempted to engage a mass movement to overthrow the regime through non-violent means (at least not yet).  That&#039;s a bit inconvenient for yr argument isn&#039;t it?  Or would you prefer that Karroubi attempt such an overthrow violently or not, begin a civil war and have Iranians by their tens of thousands slaughtered on both sides.  Would that satisfy you?  I&#039;m continually amazed at how good &quot;liberals&quot; like you can propound arguments that might get others killed w/o even realizing the implications of yr overblown rhetoric.

Since you expounded upon the religious philosophy of the Iranian clerics, can you tell me what you know about Iranian Islam?  What gives you the special expertise to label it &quot;medieval theocracy&quot; or religious obscurantism?&quot;  Have you taken any course or read any primary texts in the field of Iranian religious beliefs or practices?  Or do you learn this from anti-jihadi press releases and websites?

I am not so much &quot;defending&quot; the ayatollahs as pointing out the gross misrepresentations and distortions of yr own pt of view.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>The aggregate of the articles I’ve cited indisputably attest to both the Shah’s regime and the Khomeini revolution as bloody and detestable.</p></blockquote>
<p>Until this comment you just published you hadn&#8217;t said a word about the Shah &amp; your high moral dudgeon seemed reserved only for the Iranian Revolution.  At least you concede there was evil that preceed it.  Though of course you haven&#8217;t connected the two in a way that shows that the bloodiness of the Shah&#8217;s regime led directly to the bloodiness of the Revolution.</p>
<p>Second, you didn&#8217;t just call the Iranian regime &#8220;bloody &amp; detestable&#8221; which is a phrase I would generally accept unless it was being used in the form you are to justify war against it.  You called the regime one of the greatest evils of our generation and said Iranians were &#8220;enslaved by unqualified evil.&#8221;  The term&#8217;s &#8220;detestable&#8221; &amp; &#8220;unqualified evil&#8221; are quite different.</p>
<p>I find it interesting that you&#8217;re attempting to argue that the Shah&#8217;s rule was superior to the current government.  The only Iranians who share this view are the monarchists.  Are you one?  I also find it interesting that you, living here in Seattle, knowing very little about Iran as a country, its culture, language or even religion have decided it is a &#8220;medieval theocracy&#8221; when Iranians I know, all of whom dislike the Islamic Republic immensely and wish to see it replaced, heartily disagree with you.  One think I strongly urge is that you attempt to use a bit of nuance in yr judgments &amp; language.  It is very easy to get into high moral dudgeon and speak in slogans rather than depict reality.</p>
<blockquote><p>Mehdi Karroubi, who has spoken publicly condemning the current regime as “worse than the Shah.”</p></blockquote>
<p>Yet even someone who says the current regime is worse than the Shah does NOT support its violent overthrow as you do.  In fact, he hasn&#8217;t even attempted to engage a mass movement to overthrow the regime through non-violent means (at least not yet).  That&#8217;s a bit inconvenient for yr argument isn&#8217;t it?  Or would you prefer that Karroubi attempt such an overthrow violently or not, begin a civil war and have Iranians by their tens of thousands slaughtered on both sides.  Would that satisfy you?  I&#8217;m continually amazed at how good &#8220;liberals&#8221; like you can propound arguments that might get others killed w/o even realizing the implications of yr overblown rhetoric.</p>
<p>Since you expounded upon the religious philosophy of the Iranian clerics, can you tell me what you know about Iranian Islam?  What gives you the special expertise to label it &#8220;medieval theocracy&#8221; or religious obscurantism?&#8221;  Have you taken any course or read any primary texts in the field of Iranian religious beliefs or practices?  Or do you learn this from anti-jihadi press releases and websites?</p>
<p>I am not so much &#8220;defending&#8221; the ayatollahs as pointing out the gross misrepresentations and distortions of yr own pt of view.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel Weiner</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2009/10/22/seattles-leading-rabbi-supports-violent-overthrow-of-iranian-regime/comment-page-1/#comment-115444</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel Weiner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Oct 2009 00:26:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/?p=8835#comment-115444</guid>
		<description>Not trying to avoid anything....just focusing on one issue at a time and still hold down a full time job which precludes constant blogging...in answer to your question...first and foremost, I believe the West Bank and Gaza should never have been under Israeli auspices from the beginning, but that despite all that has happened, the Palestinians fared better than during the years under Jordanian and Egyptian authority (remember Taba...remember Black September!)  Be that as it may, it is disingenuous and inaccurate to compare the tyrannical theocracy of Iran to the democratic, pluralistic government of Israel on any measure, inclusive of the territories.  Iran lacks any of the reviews, analyses, judgments, soul-searching, military ethics and internal findings favoring the Palestinians that are the normative course in Israel&#039;s deliberations. Unfortunately, as Abba Eban stated years ago, the Palestinians never pass up an opportunity to pass up an opportunity. The scoffed at a state on a silver platter at Camp David in 2000...they were given Gaza by the most right of Israeli governments only to turn it into a point of departure for terrorism that undermined the peace-striving Israeli left...and they would have had most of the West Bank according to Olmert&#039;s stated plans of disengagement if not for the unprovoked attacks of Hezbollah in 2006.  Again, I blame the corrupt leadership of Fatah and the intransigent leadership of Hamas for their criminal negligence of the suffering of their own people.  If you want a sense of what the people of Gaza truly want, check out this morning&#039;s piece in the Times...http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/27/world/middleeast/27gaza.html?_r=1&amp;ref=world....hope this is a sufficient if not persuasive response...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not trying to avoid anything&#8230;.just focusing on one issue at a time and still hold down a full time job which precludes constant blogging&#8230;in answer to your question&#8230;first and foremost, I believe the West Bank and Gaza should never have been under Israeli auspices from the beginning, but that despite all that has happened, the Palestinians fared better than during the years under Jordanian and Egyptian authority (remember Taba&#8230;remember Black September!)  Be that as it may, it is disingenuous and inaccurate to compare the tyrannical theocracy of Iran to the democratic, pluralistic government of Israel on any measure, inclusive of the territories.  Iran lacks any of the reviews, analyses, judgments, soul-searching, military ethics and internal findings favoring the Palestinians that are the normative course in Israel&#8217;s deliberations. Unfortunately, as Abba Eban stated years ago, the Palestinians never pass up an opportunity to pass up an opportunity. The scoffed at a state on a silver platter at Camp David in 2000&#8230;they were given Gaza by the most right of Israeli governments only to turn it into a point of departure for terrorism that undermined the peace-striving Israeli left&#8230;and they would have had most of the West Bank according to Olmert&#8217;s stated plans of disengagement if not for the unprovoked attacks of Hezbollah in 2006.  Again, I blame the corrupt leadership of Fatah and the intransigent leadership of Hamas for their criminal negligence of the suffering of their own people.  If you want a sense of what the people of Gaza truly want, check out this morning&#8217;s piece in the Times&#8230;<a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/27/world/middleeast/27gaza.html?_r=1&#038;ref=world....hope" rel="nofollow">http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/27/world/middleeast/27gaza.html?_r=1&#038;ref=world&#8230;.hope</a> this is a sufficient if not persuasive response&#8230;</p>
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