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60 Responses to “Jeffrey Goldberg’s Head Explodes…Again, Over Caryl Churchill’s Gaza Play”

1. Alex Stein says:

   February 25, 2009 at 1:45 AM

   Richard, again you have to read things properly.

   I said: “I actually have much more day to day contact with real Palestinians than you do – not as much as I should have but still more than the people of Seattle.” A fairly small claim, which you choose to magnify thus:

   “You’ve made a claim that you have enough real interactions with Palestinians in order to understand what they really think, want and believe—from first hand information.”

   If you can explain where you got the second half of that sentence from, I will be able to continue with this conversation with you.

   I also notice that some of my comments haven’t been modified, while others have. If you could rectify that I’d appreciate it. Cheers.

   Reply
   • Richard Silverstein says:

     February 25, 2009 at 3:40 PM

     I also notice that some of my comments haven’t been modified

     I think you mean “moderated.”

     I don’t feature links to Harry’s Place as I find it little more than a propaganda mill, one of whose authors wrote a nasty, slashing, piece of crap post about my views of the Mumbai attack. That’s why I haven’t approved that comment.

     If you & Peter Tatchell choose to write there doesn’t mean that I have to promote the site here.

     Reply
2. Alex Stein says:

   February 25, 2009 at 10:09 PM

   You should add that to the rules, it would make things clearer. In any case, you can see more evidence of Tatchell’s integrity in this piece on CIF – http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/libertycentral/2009/feb/23/hicham-yezza

   Will you be replying to my last comment? I’m ready to answer your question as soon as you acknowledge I never claimed to “understand what they [Palestinians] really think, want and believe – from first hand information.” I assume you don’t like it when people make up things about you; neither do I.

   Reply
3. Joshua says:

   February 26, 2009 at 7:18 PM

   “I think, however, that to explain all minority problems in Palestinian society solely in terms of the occupation is a step too far.”

   You oversimplify and you excoriate Richard for supposedly doing so at your expense. No one stated the occupation defines every sector of Palestinian social life but I think you underestimate its permeating effects as you think as much as I overstate. Studies have shown how badly effected the children of Gaza are by the turmoil and children in schools paint pictures of deaths. This really doesn’t bode well for a healthy society. Secondly, the occupation is a great purveyor of violence and that violence can breed further to its own oppressed people (I guess I am hinting more at Franz Fanon’s brilliant work on colonialism, Wretched Of The Earth.) that has hierarchal status.

   What I find confusing is that there are minority problems everywhere in this world, some even more horrendous in Western nations than the Palestinians, and in effect, the Palestinians are even a minority of their own in other countries and in Israel itself, and you have stated earlier that you base your judgements equally on everyone (which is kind of unrealistic and duplicitous). I guess it is just pandering over nothing as it seems you have concern for minorities wherever they are and wherever there are problems, even with the Palestinians, they should be understood and criticsed and hopefully highlighted but I think the “minority” issue with the Palestinians is really the least of their problems right now and what is imperative is that this should not be an obstacle to prevent any form of self-governance or self-determination for the Palestinians (or whether they want a single state). It should not be held as a prerequisite for “moderation” or a policy to get the Palestinians to qualify to be a “partner for peace”.

   Just like other issues that claim the leftist sphere (South America, Iran, Russia, Africa), the battle against imperialism and colonisation should not overwhelm the problems of the nascent states also (thinking of Cuba and Venezuela, just because they are left-leaning and oppose U.S. foreign policy should not shield them from criticism of their own human rights violations). But let’s also put everything in the proper context and try to understand the road that led to this stage in all its forms and not base conclusions on dogmas that has no basis on reality.

   Reply
4. Joshua says:

   February 26, 2009 at 7:27 PM

   http://assafir.com/Article.aspx?EditionId=1169&ChannelId=26815&ArticleId=2285&Author=

   A demonstration in Beirut for, guess what, yup, Gay and Lesbian rights. (It’s in Arabic.)

   Reply
5. Alex Stein says:

   February 26, 2009 at 11:21 PM

   I totally agree that it shouldn’t be an obstacle to their independnece, and nor do I think it is a particularly major issue right now. But it was brought up in discussion, and I think i was was worth commenting on . Your points are very interesting, btw.

   Reply