http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qibya_massacre

The 1982 invasion of Lebanon also involved massive bombing raids on Beirut and other places, which killed thousands of civilians.

Sabra/Shatila can’t be so easily dismissed either, as you choose to do. The record of the Christian Phalangists was well known to everyone–when Sharon sent them into the camps it was exactly like sending KKK units to patrol a black neighborhood.

As for Israel’s human rights record in general, one very good source is the Israeli human rights group B’Tselem. You can look it up. There is also Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International. There are also numerous articles that appear in magazines such as The New York
Review of Books, the London Review, Harper’s, etc…

All of this is a waste of time. If you had the slightest trace of openmindedness about this, you’d know that both sides have committed atrocities and you wouldn’t need strangers on the web to spoon feed you this stuff. You’ve already encountered this material and dismissed it or chosen not to look in the first place.

http://www.robert-fisk.com/robert-fisk_06feb2001.htm

http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/fisk/ariel-sharon-by-robert-fisk-521809.html

..though we’re barely scratching the surface.

I have a question about Ariel Sharon. On this site, I see Posts by Ryckert and Donald in which there are statments, about one sentence long which state that Ariel Sharon is a murderer.

I would like to know the following:

Who did Sharon kill and when and where did the murder take place?

I’ve posted this question several times and I do not receive an answer.

This is my last try. I hope someone who knows the answer to that question will respond

Dennis Cook

..a good item here, if you missed it:

http://www.counterpunch.com/avnery07192008.html

Why not say that if German Jews had the power of the State, they would have behaved no better than the Nazis?

Because Jews never had any conflict with the German state as Hezbollah has with the State of Israel.

As for the allegation that there is an “official IDF policy” of child murder & torture…all the incidents you mention are true & indicate a deep callousness on the part of the Border Police & IDF. But to say that this is “official policy” of the entire State or entire IDF is stretching things beyond reason.

then-fuhrer Sharon

This is petty, lazy, lame-assed grandstanding. Argue facts & not emotions. If you want to shout slogans calling Israeli leaders Nazis you’ll have to go somewhere else to do that.
@Judy:

Do you really mean that, Richard?

I don’t put much stock in Hezbollah as a humanitarian movement. Comparing the relative callousness of Israel vs. Hezbollah I’d be hard-pressed to say which is better or worse.

One thing I will say is that during the Lebanon war it seemed to me that Hezbollah was far more disciplined both on the battlefield & in terms of its political strategy. I was impressed that when Israel called for a lull in fighting under international pressure that Hezbollah responded in kind. It showed a political maturity that Israel lacked.

But do I have faith that were Hezbollah to become king-makers in Lebanon they would be any better at governing than any other sect or ethnic group? I doubt it.

Perhaps I overstated a bit in saying Hezbollah would be willing to deliberately kill Israeli children if it would advance its political agenda. Maybe it wouldn’t. But the fact that no one from Hezbollah or Lebanon seems willing to confront the enormity of Kuntar’s 1979 acts is troublesome. Yes, I understand that Israel is responsible for killing many Lebanese & Palestinian children. Yes, I understand the enormous hostility this generates against Israel. And yes, such hostility is justified. But why not the least awareness of or sensitivity to pain on the other side? Are we so anesthetized by our own particular suffering that we cannot acknowledge the suffering of the other??

I have no idea what this assertion is based on. Why not say that if German Jews had the power of the State, they would have behaved no better than the Nazis? Why should this be so? The statement has no basis.

“I don’t agree that child murder or torture is the official policy of Israel. But I do believe that the IDF is perfectly willing to accept the killing of children as collateral damage in their efforts to subjugate the Palestinian people.”

But the Israeis are NOT merely reckless toward innocent life. They absolutely DO target children. This has been reported over and over and over again. Often Israeli IDF show up in their jeeps and hang around until they shoot someone, very often a child, sometimes with live ammunition, sometimes with a rubber coated bullet. Sometimes the child receives a nasty wound, sometimes he or she is blinded or has a lung perforated and other times they are killed. An “investigation” follows, no one is charged and that’s how it is. This has been going on for decades, while the Israelis crow about their superior regard for human life.

Here’s the former NYTimes Mid East Bureau Chief Chris Hedges describing a typical day:

“And I walked out towards the dunes and they were–the–over the loudspeaker from an Israeli army Jeep on the other side of the electric fence they were taunting these kids. And these kids started to throw rocks. And most of these kids were 10, 11, 12 years old. And, first of all, the rocks were the size of a fist. They were being hurled towards a Jeep that was armor-plated. I doubt they could even hit the Jeep. And then I watched the soldiers open fire. And it was–I mean, I’ve seen kids shot in Sarajevo. I mean, snipers would shoot kids in Sarajevo. I’ve seen death squads kill families in Algeria or El Salvador. But I’d never seen soldiers bait or taunt kids like this and then shoot them for sport. It was–I just–even now, I find it almost inconceivable. And I went back every day, and every day it was the same. ”

http://www.bintjbeil.com/articles/en/011001_hedges.html

Or they drop a two ton bomb on a housing complex full of children, certain to murder children in addition to their “target” as they did in the Shaheda case. The pilot was welcomed home and profusely congratulated by then-fuhrer Sharon. Again, routine and completely unremarkable. (We’re not even talking about the fact that an entire generation of Palestinian children has been severely traumatized and mentally scarred for life by what the Israeli occupation has done to them.)

But hezbollah are now dubbed child-murderers because a guy who is neither Shiite nor a Hezbollah member killed an Israeli child 30 years ago? We should launch a grieving party for the families of the two IDF soldiers while utterly ignoring the 190 families of the Lebanese, whose bodies Israel returned in the prisoner exchange?

What would have happened if the guy who deliberately crushed Rachel Corrie with a bulldozer were imprisoned in the West Bank and then repatriated after a prisoner exchange? You think he’d be condemned in Israel? Fat chance. They’d throw a ticker tape parade, but of course, he was never charged with anything and the US government refused the family’s request for an independent investigation.

and so it goes.

1.I frequently see bloggers on this site state that Sharon is a murderer. No facts that identify the who/why/what/ when of the murders he is supposed to have committed. I would like to know who he murdered ( or murders which he ordered ) when were they ordered, and was any official inquiry made into the murders.

2. I frequently see insertions on this blog by participants who say that Israel allows those who murder Arabs to go unpunished. Does anyone know if Israel has ever indicted a Jewish person for deliberate murder of an Arab person.If so, the dates and the who/how /when, of the indictment, please.

3.Does anyone know if an Arab person has ever been indicted by either the PA or by an Arab country ( like Lebanon ) for the murder of an Israeli Jew/If so, dates, and particulars , please. ( I believe there have been instances where Jordan has indicted and tried Jordanians and Palestinians for the murder of Israelis .I’d like to know if there are other Arab countries who have done likewise.

or support is given for that reference do not provide details to support that allegation. Could someone please tell me the who, what, when where of the murders alleged to have been committed by Sharon.

2.

Do you really mean that, Richard?