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	<title>Comments on: Jewlicious Violates Copyright, Joins in Plaut, Masada2000 Cyber-Bullying Campaign</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/</link>
	<description>Essays on politics, culture and ideas about Israeli-Arab peace and world music</description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 01 Dec 2008 18:03:23 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Richard Silverstein</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-24080</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Silverstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jun 2007 18:16:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-24080</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;you asked him to prove something, yet you banned him. I am also troubled by the fact you made an allegation, seemingly without without any factual basis, and then ask for proof to disprove the allegation. Would you like to be treated this way?&lt;/blockquote&gt;
I am treated this way all the time both here &#038; at other sites.  Someone makes what I consider an inaccurate statement.  I say so.  They respond: "prove it."  And if I have the proof I do.  That's generally the way discussions &#038; political argument works.

My statement was not "seemingly without factual basis."  It was based on a conversation I had with a blogger who knows quite a bit about the inner workings of PJM.

I didn't ban Aussie Dave because I didn't want him to present his proof.  I banned him because he called me a "liar" w/o any proof of the claim.  My comment rules clearly indicate (read them please) that if you make such charges against me you are liable to be banned.

Also, I offered to publish any proof he would provide and said that I would believe him if he offered it.  If he was acting in good faith he would take me up on this offer.  Instead, his response was to promise me a lawsuit for being a "liar," a charge he still hasn't proven.  Thankfully, judges have a bit higher standard of proof than Aussie Dave seems to have.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>you asked him to prove something, yet you banned him. I am also troubled by the fact you made an allegation, seemingly without without any factual basis, and then ask for proof to disprove the allegation. Would you like to be treated this way?</p></blockquote>
<p>I am treated this way all the time both here &#038; at other sites.  Someone makes what I consider an inaccurate statement.  I say so.  They respond: &#8220;prove it.&#8221;  And if I have the proof I do.  That&#8217;s generally the way discussions &#038; political argument works.</p>
<p>My statement was not &#8220;seemingly without factual basis.&#8221;  It was based on a conversation I had with a blogger who knows quite a bit about the inner workings of PJM.</p>
<p>I didn&#8217;t ban Aussie Dave because I didn&#8217;t want him to present his proof.  I banned him because he called me a &#8220;liar&#8221; w/o any proof of the claim.  My comment rules clearly indicate (read them please) that if you make such charges against me you are liable to be banned.</p>
<p>Also, I offered to publish any proof he would provide and said that I would believe him if he offered it.  If he was acting in good faith he would take me up on this offer.  Instead, his response was to promise me a lawsuit for being a &#8220;liar,&#8221; a charge he still hasn&#8217;t proven.  Thankfully, judges have a bit higher standard of proof than Aussie Dave seems to have.</p>
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		<title>By: Angela</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-24016</link>
		<dc:creator>Angela</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jun 2007 10:52:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-24016</guid>
		<description>I have to concur with the other commenter - you asked him to prove something, yet you banned him. I am also troubled by the fact you made an allegation, seemingly without without any factual basis, and then ask for proof to disprove the allegation. Would you like to be treated this way?

I am sorry Richard, but you are in the wrong here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to concur with the other commenter - you asked him to prove something, yet you banned him. I am also troubled by the fact you made an allegation, seemingly without without any factual basis, and then ask for proof to disprove the allegation. Would you like to be treated this way?</p>
<p>I am sorry Richard, but you are in the wrong here.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Silverstein</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-23994</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Silverstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jun 2007 07:58:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-23994</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;He can’t respond if he’s been banned.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Oh, trust me.  He has my e mail address.  He'll give me a piece of his mind.  But if he chooses to provide the proof I'll publish the comment.  But I strongly doubt he will.

If his next e mail manages not to accuse me of lying or beating my wife, then I'll likely unban him--till he goes &#038; says something obnoxious again (there's always a next time with him).

Another reason I have to ban him periodically is that he'll publish 20 comments in this thread if I let him saying virtually the same thing over &#038; over again.

&lt;strong&gt;UPDATE&lt;/strong&gt;: Wouldn't you know, Aussie Dave didn't waste any time in e mailing me as I wrote above.  He's now threatened (or promised--I can't tell which) a lawsuit.  Not sure what the grounds would be--other than allegedly lying and making him very, very mad.  Sit tight everyone, this could get hairy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>He can’t respond if he’s been banned.</p></blockquote>
<p>Oh, trust me.  He has my e mail address.  He&#8217;ll give me a piece of his mind.  But if he chooses to provide the proof I&#8217;ll publish the comment.  But I strongly doubt he will.</p>
<p>If his next e mail manages not to accuse me of lying or beating my wife, then I&#8217;ll likely unban him&#8211;till he goes &#038; says something obnoxious again (there&#8217;s always a next time with him).</p>
<p>Another reason I have to ban him periodically is that he&#8217;ll publish 20 comments in this thread if I let him saying virtually the same thing over &#038; over again.</p>
<p><strong>UPDATE</strong>: Wouldn&#8217;t you know, Aussie Dave didn&#8217;t waste any time in e mailing me as I wrote above.  He&#8217;s now threatened (or promised&#8211;I can&#8217;t tell which) a lawsuit.  Not sure what the grounds would be&#8211;other than allegedly lying and making him very, very mad.  Sit tight everyone, this could get hairy.</p>
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		<title>By: amir</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-23991</link>
		<dc:creator>amir</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jun 2007 07:48:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-23991</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt; It’s not lying unless I know it not to be true. If you can prove here that you resigned rather than were dropped then I can accept yr word. &lt;/blockquote&gt; He can't respond if he's been banned.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p> It’s not lying unless I know it not to be true. If you can prove here that you resigned rather than were dropped then I can accept yr word. </p></blockquote>
<p> He can&#8217;t respond if he&#8217;s been banned.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Silverstein</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-23988</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Silverstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jun 2007 07:33:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-23988</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Leaving aside the fact that I clearly notified you to take it down (and the last time I did this&lt;/blockquote&gt;
No, you're implying you asked me more than once &#038; you didn't.  When you demanded I remove it I did initially.  But petty annoyance with you got the better of me and I reposted a heavily edited picture which totally obliterated your image.  I shouldn't have done that.  I shouldn't have posted any image at all, even one that essentially WAS no longer an image of you.  But I didn't &#038; I'm sorry for that.  The image is gone as you say and will not return.
&lt;blockquote&gt;For the record, I left PJM, and was not booted. Another case of blatant lying.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
You're confusing a lie with an inaccurate statement.  If I say something I know not to be true, that's a lie.  That's clearly not what I did since a number of PJM bloggers were dropped at the precise time your affilation ended.  It would be only reasonable to assume that just as their contracts were not renewed, yours wasn't as well.  If you can prove here that you resigned rather than were dropped then I can accept yr word.  If you can't do that then I'll accept Dennis the Peasant's word that a number of PJMers were dropped around last April because they weren't pulling their numbers and that you likely were one of them.
&lt;blockquote&gt;I want your readers to know that you lie about the small things AND the larger things.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Nothing you said in yr comment shows me to be a liar.  And for calling me one w/o any proof whatsoever you're banned once again for a few weeks.
&lt;blockquote&gt;If you weren’t so prone to moderating and amending my comments, I would take you to task for much of what you write which is patantly false and shows intellectual laziness and dishonesty.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Come off it, you've written thousands of words in my comment threads vainly attempting to do precisely that.  If you haven't succeeded till now you clearly won't fare any better in future attempts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Leaving aside the fact that I clearly notified you to take it down (and the last time I did this</p></blockquote>
<p>No, you&#8217;re implying you asked me more than once &#038; you didn&#8217;t.  When you demanded I remove it I did initially.  But petty annoyance with you got the better of me and I reposted a heavily edited picture which totally obliterated your image.  I shouldn&#8217;t have done that.  I shouldn&#8217;t have posted any image at all, even one that essentially WAS no longer an image of you.  But I didn&#8217;t &#038; I&#8217;m sorry for that.  The image is gone as you say and will not return.</p>
<blockquote><p>For the record, I left PJM, and was not booted. Another case of blatant lying.</p></blockquote>
<p>You&#8217;re confusing a lie with an inaccurate statement.  If I say something I know not to be true, that&#8217;s a lie.  That&#8217;s clearly not what I did since a number of PJM bloggers were dropped at the precise time your affilation ended.  It would be only reasonable to assume that just as their contracts were not renewed, yours wasn&#8217;t as well.  If you can prove here that you resigned rather than were dropped then I can accept yr word.  If you can&#8217;t do that then I&#8217;ll accept Dennis the Peasant&#8217;s word that a number of PJMers were dropped around last April because they weren&#8217;t pulling their numbers and that you likely were one of them.</p>
<blockquote><p>I want your readers to know that you lie about the small things AND the larger things.</p></blockquote>
<p>Nothing you said in yr comment shows me to be a liar.  And for calling me one w/o any proof whatsoever you&#8217;re banned once again for a few weeks.</p>
<blockquote><p>If you weren’t so prone to moderating and amending my comments, I would take you to task for much of what you write which is patantly false and shows intellectual laziness and dishonesty.</p></blockquote>
<p>Come off it, you&#8217;ve written thousands of words in my comment threads vainly attempting to do precisely that.  If you haven&#8217;t succeeded till now you clearly won&#8217;t fare any better in future attempts.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Silverstein</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-23984</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Silverstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jun 2007 07:16:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-23984</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;in principal, I don’t see how what you do is morally different from what you are accusing others of doing.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
There are several distinctions at least as I see it.  First, I believe in reciprocating so that if anyone asks me for free use of my images I always oblige unless they are making a commerical use of it or using it to defame me.  Second, when I use an image I do not defame or insult the copyright owner as Plaut, Masada2000 and Jewlicious have done.  Third, Masada2000 also includes with each image it features, the personal e mail address of the victim which is an ever deeper privacy violation. Fourth, it is common practice for many millions of bloggers to use images in the way I have.  Fifth, I always credit the photographer in my blog so that people know whose photo I'm using.  Sixth, I prominently state that I will immediately remove any image if a copyright holder wishes me to.

The sites I mention above violate each of these provisions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>in principal, I don’t see how what you do is morally different from what you are accusing others of doing.</p></blockquote>
<p>There are several distinctions at least as I see it.  First, I believe in reciprocating so that if anyone asks me for free use of my images I always oblige unless they are making a commerical use of it or using it to defame me.  Second, when I use an image I do not defame or insult the copyright owner as Plaut, Masada2000 and Jewlicious have done.  Third, Masada2000 also includes with each image it features, the personal e mail address of the victim which is an ever deeper privacy violation. Fourth, it is common practice for many millions of bloggers to use images in the way I have.  Fifth, I always credit the photographer in my blog so that people know whose photo I&#8217;m using.  Sixth, I prominently state that I will immediately remove any image if a copyright holder wishes me to.</p>
<p>The sites I mention above violate each of these provisions.</p>
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		<title>By: Aussie Dave</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-23981</link>
		<dc:creator>Aussie Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jun 2007 07:03:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-23981</guid>
		<description>Leaving aside the fact that I clearly notified you to take it down (and the last time I did this, you left it up but smudged out the face - would you like me to provide a screen capture of it?!), it is clear you are hypocrite, since leaving aside the copyright issues, here is your complaint from the post:
"One of the tactics Plaut and Masada2000 have used in their cyber-bullying campaign against me (and in the case of Masada2000–thousands of other Jewish peace activists in its S.H.I.T. List) is to feature their images along with defaming, often vulgar captions."

You clearly put up the image on your site with a mocking, defaming caption. So quit whining about bad behavior of which you are also guilty.

For the record, I left PJM, and was not booted. Another case of blatant lying. 

I want your readers to know that you lie about the small things AND the larger things. If you weren't so prone to moderating and amending my comments, I would take you to task for much of what you write which is patantly false and shows intellectual laziness and dishonesty.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Leaving aside the fact that I clearly notified you to take it down (and the last time I did this, you left it up but smudged out the face - would you like me to provide a screen capture of it?!), it is clear you are hypocrite, since leaving aside the copyright issues, here is your complaint from the post:<br />
&#8220;One of the tactics Plaut and Masada2000 have used in their cyber-bullying campaign against me (and in the case of Masada2000–thousands of other Jewish peace activists in its S.H.I.T. List) is to feature their images along with defaming, often vulgar captions.&#8221;</p>
<p>You clearly put up the image on your site with a mocking, defaming caption. So quit whining about bad behavior of which you are also guilty.</p>
<p>For the record, I left PJM, and was not booted. Another case of blatant lying. </p>
<p>I want your readers to know that you lie about the small things AND the larger things. If you weren&#8217;t so prone to moderating and amending my comments, I would take you to task for much of what you write which is patantly false and shows intellectual laziness and dishonesty.</p>
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		<title>By: amir</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-23979</link>
		<dc:creator>amir</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jun 2007 07:00:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-23979</guid>
		<description>Frankly, RS, I don't understant your position. I don't blog. I'm not a lawyer and don't understand copyright law pasrticularly pertaining to the internet. I dont know RS, Aussie Save, CK or anyone from Jewlicious or from the web site mocking RS. I have no personel interest in this blog war. But from the answer you gave to my question, you admit that you use copyrighted images without permission from news services. You do this becasue getting permission would be 1) cumbersome 2) costly and 3) timely. Yoy know that if you asked permission to post images for free, that the owner of the image sells, permission would most likely be denied so you post the image knowing that no one is going to bother with a small blog. Nevertheless, in principal, I don't see how what you do is morally different from what you are accusing others of doing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Frankly, RS, I don&#8217;t understant your position. I don&#8217;t blog. I&#8217;m not a lawyer and don&#8217;t understand copyright law pasrticularly pertaining to the internet. I dont know RS, Aussie Save, CK or anyone from Jewlicious or from the web site mocking RS. I have no personel interest in this blog war. But from the answer you gave to my question, you admit that you use copyrighted images without permission from news services. You do this becasue getting permission would be 1) cumbersome 2) costly and 3) timely. Yoy know that if you asked permission to post images for free, that the owner of the image sells, permission would most likely be denied so you post the image knowing that no one is going to bother with a small blog. Nevertheless, in principal, I don&#8217;t see how what you do is morally different from what you are accusing others of doing.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Silverstein</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-23973</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Silverstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jun 2007 06:34:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-23973</guid>
		<description>I took the image fr. the PJM site, not fr. yr site.  The image did not say you held the copyright.  I thought PJM held the copyright since you were affiliated with them.  How would I know what you write at yr site about yr images when at that pt. I'd never visited yr site?

You show me one message you ever sent to me directly asking me SPECIFICALLY to take the image down.  You show me one attempt you ever made to get my webhost to take it down.  I make it a habit to never read yr site unless I have to.  I never saw any statement you made at yr site asking me to take the image down if you did make one.  I did not know you wanted it taken down.  Even when you wrote to me initially that you didn't like my displaying the image you NEVER asked me to take it down.  You waited a year after I put the image up &#038; then demanded I take it down.  And you only did that because you were pissed that I compared the group running the current JIB award process favorably to the way you ran it.  Why did you allow the image to remain on my site that long if it bothered you so much?

Unlike you, I have complained loudly &#038; vociferously to the webhosts hosting the sites which have violated my copyright &#038; done so immediately after finding out about the violations.  They will be receiving second DMCA notices next week.  It's also likely the copyright violators themselves will receive cease and desist letters personally in the near future.  Unlike the way you related to me, both they &#038; their webhosts will know what I want.

To say that I left up the image of you but smudged out yr face is ridiculous.  There was no image of you.  There was a black space where yr image used to be.  No one would know it was you.  Even the caption for the image didn't mention you.

I expected this response fr. you.  I wonder why it took you so long.

Oh, &#038; I'm really sorry to hear that PJM dropped you as one of their featured bloggers.  You really were meant for ea. other.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I took the image fr. the PJM site, not fr. yr site.  The image did not say you held the copyright.  I thought PJM held the copyright since you were affiliated with them.  How would I know what you write at yr site about yr images when at that pt. I&#8217;d never visited yr site?</p>
<p>You show me one message you ever sent to me directly asking me SPECIFICALLY to take the image down.  You show me one attempt you ever made to get my webhost to take it down.  I make it a habit to never read yr site unless I have to.  I never saw any statement you made at yr site asking me to take the image down if you did make one.  I did not know you wanted it taken down.  Even when you wrote to me initially that you didn&#8217;t like my displaying the image you NEVER asked me to take it down.  You waited a year after I put the image up &#038; then demanded I take it down.  And you only did that because you were pissed that I compared the group running the current JIB award process favorably to the way you ran it.  Why did you allow the image to remain on my site that long if it bothered you so much?</p>
<p>Unlike you, I have complained loudly &#038; vociferously to the webhosts hosting the sites which have violated my copyright &#038; done so immediately after finding out about the violations.  They will be receiving second DMCA notices next week.  It&#8217;s also likely the copyright violators themselves will receive cease and desist letters personally in the near future.  Unlike the way you related to me, both they &#038; their webhosts will know what I want.</p>
<p>To say that I left up the image of you but smudged out yr face is ridiculous.  There was no image of you.  There was a black space where yr image used to be.  No one would know it was you.  Even the caption for the image didn&#8217;t mention you.</p>
<p>I expected this response fr. you.  I wonder why it took you so long.</p>
<p>Oh, &#038; I&#8217;m really sorry to hear that PJM dropped you as one of their featured bloggers.  You really were meant for ea. other.</p>
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		<title>By: Aussie Dave</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-23968</link>
		<dc:creator>Aussie Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jun 2007 05:51:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/06/04/jewlicious-lies-down-with-plaut-gets-fleas/#comment-23968</guid>
		<description>You stole my image of me from the PJM site - despite the legal terms on my site that clearly state this is not allowed - and then proceeded to post it on your site, add your own mocking caption, and leave it up for over a year, despite my repeated requests for you to take down. And when I threatened you with legal action, you still left up the image, but merely smudged out my face. Now I see you finally replaced it.

So cry us a river. You are a hypocrite.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You stole my image of me from the PJM site - despite the legal terms on my site that clearly state this is not allowed - and then proceeded to post it on your site, add your own mocking caption, and leave it up for over a year, despite my repeated requests for you to take down. And when I threatened you with legal action, you still left up the image, but merely smudged out my face. Now I see you finally replaced it.</p>
<p>So cry us a river. You are a hypocrite.</p>
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