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	<title>Comments on: Dersh and Plaut: Lie Down With Dogs, Get Up With Fleas</title>
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	<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/05/31/dersh-and-plaut-lie-down-with-dogs-get-up-with-fleas/</link>
	<description>Essays on politics, culture and ideas about Israeli-Arab peace and world music</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 30 Aug 2008 13:31:42 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Richard Silverstein</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/05/31/dersh-and-plaut-lie-down-with-dogs-get-up-with-fleas/#comment-23282</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Silverstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Jun 2007 06:57:53 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Please give me a source that says Israel no longer claims the Shaaba farms.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Israel never "claimed" Shebaa Farms.  It &lt;a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shebaa_farms" rel="nofollow"&gt;acknowledges&lt;/a&gt; it conquered this territory from Syria:
&lt;blockquote&gt;Israel is of the view that the land was Syrian at the time that Israel conquered it during the Six Day War.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&#038; &lt;a href="http://www.mfa.gov.il/mfa/about%20the%20ministry/mfa%20spokesman/2002/the%20legal%20status%20of%20the%20shabaa%20farms%20-%208-apr-2002" rel="nofollow"&gt;recognizes&lt;/a&gt; that it will be transferred back to Syria when a peace agreement is finalized:
&lt;blockquote&gt;The status of these territories can ultimately be finalized in direct peace negotiations between Israel and Syria.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Syria however has at times acknowledged that the territory should not be considered Syrian, but rather Lebanese.  The question isn't whether the territory is Israeli or not, but whether, when there is peace Israel will return it to one country or the other.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Please give me a source that says Israel no longer claims the Shaaba farms.</p></blockquote>
<p>Israel never &#8220;claimed&#8221; Shebaa Farms.  It <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shebaa_farms" rel="nofollow" onclick="javascript:pageTracker._trackPageview('/outbound/comment/http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shebaa_farms');">acknowledges</a> it conquered this territory from Syria:</p>
<blockquote><p>Israel is of the view that the land was Syrian at the time that Israel conquered it during the Six Day War.</p></blockquote>
<p>&#038; <a href="http://www.mfa.gov.il/mfa/about%20the%20ministry/mfa%20spokesman/2002/the%20legal%20status%20of%20the%20shabaa%20farms%20-%208-apr-2002" rel="nofollow" onclick="javascript:pageTracker._trackPageview('/outbound/comment/http://www.mfa.gov.il/mfa/about%20the%20ministry/mfa%20spokesman/2002/the%20legal%20status%20of%20the%20shabaa%20farms%20-%208-apr-2002');">recognizes</a> that it will be transferred back to Syria when a peace agreement is finalized:</p>
<blockquote><p>The status of these territories can ultimately be finalized in direct peace negotiations between Israel and Syria.</p></blockquote>
<p>Syria however has at times acknowledged that the territory should not be considered Syrian, but rather Lebanese.  The question isn&#8217;t whether the territory is Israeli or not, but whether, when there is peace Israel will return it to one country or the other.</p>
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		<title>By: JohnYorke</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/05/31/dersh-and-plaut-lie-down-with-dogs-get-up-with-fleas/#comment-23270</link>
		<dc:creator>JohnYorke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Jun 2007 03:03:02 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Hello Spyros,

You make a number of very valid observations.

All of the world's major religions, at one time or another, have each been suborned by those seeking to promote their own and very often violent agenda. God's allegiance has all too frequently been claimed by clergy, politicians and combatants alike in the quest for some final 'victory.' Quite why God should favour one section of His children over another is a question rarely asked. In God's own interaction with Man, the relationship has always been based more on the individual rather than the group. 
 
Attempts to polarise Christianity, Islam and Judaism have hardly helped matters in the Middle East. Whether such polarisation can be reversed is a moot point. That it exists is certainly evident. To counteract the situation, a depolarisation might be the only remedy, heralding a less sanguine,  more human dimension in the outcome of events there.

I'm reminded of that old sci-fi film 'The day the Earth stood still.' This is the one where, at the very end, the choice for mankind comes down to an abandonment of all major conflict on Earth or face the wrath of 'Gort,' an eight foot tall robot capable of dealing out death and destruction on a planetary scale. Though it's well over fifty years since his first appearance, 'Gort' still sends a chill into my bones whenever the film is shown, even on the small screen. It could be that we need something just as cold and impersonal - and as devastating - to control what's going on in so many theatres of war. Since it's most unlikely some passing alien will shortly oblige us with anything like the original, we may have to create our very own version of 'Gort.'
 
 In this context, all of us get to become 'Gort, ' who might then be considered the first truly global policeman. I think there is a pressing need for such a creature.

http://yorketowers.blogspot.com

JY</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello Spyros,</p>
<p>You make a number of very valid observations.</p>
<p>All of the world&#8217;s major religions, at one time or another, have each been suborned by those seeking to promote their own and very often violent agenda. God&#8217;s allegiance has all too frequently been claimed by clergy, politicians and combatants alike in the quest for some final &#8216;victory.&#8217; Quite why God should favour one section of His children over another is a question rarely asked. In God&#8217;s own interaction with Man, the relationship has always been based more on the individual rather than the group. </p>
<p>Attempts to polarise Christianity, Islam and Judaism have hardly helped matters in the Middle East. Whether such polarisation can be reversed is a moot point. That it exists is certainly evident. To counteract the situation, a depolarisation might be the only remedy, heralding a less sanguine,  more human dimension in the outcome of events there.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m reminded of that old sci-fi film &#8216;The day the Earth stood still.&#8217; This is the one where, at the very end, the choice for mankind comes down to an abandonment of all major conflict on Earth or face the wrath of &#8216;Gort,&#8217; an eight foot tall robot capable of dealing out death and destruction on a planetary scale. Though it&#8217;s well over fifty years since his first appearance, &#8216;Gort&#8217; still sends a chill into my bones whenever the film is shown, even on the small screen. It could be that we need something just as cold and impersonal - and as devastating - to control what&#8217;s going on in so many theatres of war. Since it&#8217;s most unlikely some passing alien will shortly oblige us with anything like the original, we may have to create our very own version of &#8216;Gort.&#8217;</p>
<p> In this context, all of us get to become &#8216;Gort, &#8216; who might then be considered the first truly global policeman. I think there is a pressing need for such a creature.</p>
<p><a href="http://yorketowers.blogspot.com" rel="nofollow" onclick="javascript:pageTracker._trackPageview('/outbound/comment/http://yorketowers.blogspot.com');">http://yorketowers.blogspot.com</a></p>
<p>JY</p>
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		<title>By: imjudy</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/05/31/dersh-and-plaut-lie-down-with-dogs-get-up-with-fleas/#comment-23212</link>
		<dc:creator>imjudy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Jun 2007 14:30:41 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Please give me a source that says Israel no longer claims the Shaaba farms.
Ha'aretz stated that Israel should give it up, but the government has
refused to. If it belonged to Lebanon, then the UN would have stated that. They didn't, which means it is part of the Golan Heights.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Please give me a source that says Israel no longer claims the Shaaba farms.<br />
Ha&#8217;aretz stated that Israel should give it up, but the government has<br />
refused to. If it belonged to Lebanon, then the UN would have stated that. They didn&#8217;t, which means it is part of the Golan Heights.</p>
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		<title>By: Spyros YUng</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/05/31/dersh-and-plaut-lie-down-with-dogs-get-up-with-fleas/#comment-23196</link>
		<dc:creator>Spyros YUng</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Jun 2007 11:46:18 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Comment deleted.

[ed., The purpose of my blog is not to promote groups like the Free Muslim Coalition.  My blog is not a free billboard for yr political views.  I urge you to promote this group on sites more conducive to yr views.  If you'd used a valid e mail address in publishing this comment I could've communicated personally my reasons for deleting this comment to you.] </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Comment deleted.</p>
<p>[ed., The purpose of my blog is not to promote groups like the Free Muslim Coalition.  My blog is not a free billboard for yr political views.  I urge you to promote this group on sites more conducive to yr views.  If you'd used a valid e mail address in publishing this comment I could've communicated personally my reasons for deleting this comment to you.]</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Silverstein</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/05/31/dersh-and-plaut-lie-down-with-dogs-get-up-with-fleas/#comment-23144</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Silverstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Jun 2007 04:29:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/05/31/dersh-and-plaut-lie-down-with-dogs-get-up-with-fleas/#comment-23144</guid>
		<description>You are misinformed &#038; yr gratuitous attack on Haaretz is silly.  Israel has conceded that the territory will eventually be returned to either Lebanon or Syria.  It is waiting for a decision bet. the 2 as to who to return it to.  Pls. provide any credible source that supports yr view that Israel has not conceded Shebaa Farms.
&lt;blockquote&gt;In any event is kidnapping, murder and rocket attacks the best way to resolve the matter?&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Don't get on yr high horse.  Do a little reading on this site &#038; you will discover my views of Hezbollah's tactics.  Just because Finkelstein is enamored of Hezbollah doesn't mean I am.  Pls. don't make the mistake that most right-wingers make here of lumping my views in w. whoever you happen to dislike most among progressive Jews.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You are misinformed &#038; yr gratuitous attack on Haaretz is silly.  Israel has conceded that the territory will eventually be returned to either Lebanon or Syria.  It is waiting for a decision bet. the 2 as to who to return it to.  Pls. provide any credible source that supports yr view that Israel has not conceded Shebaa Farms.</p>
<blockquote><p>In any event is kidnapping, murder and rocket attacks the best way to resolve the matter?</p></blockquote>
<p>Don&#8217;t get on yr high horse.  Do a little reading on this site &#038; you will discover my views of Hezbollah&#8217;s tactics.  Just because Finkelstein is enamored of Hezbollah doesn&#8217;t mean I am.  Pls. don&#8217;t make the mistake that most right-wingers make here of lumping my views in w. whoever you happen to dislike most among progressive Jews.</p>
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		<title>By: imjudy</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/05/31/dersh-and-plaut-lie-down-with-dogs-get-up-with-fleas/#comment-23143</link>
		<dc:creator>imjudy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Jun 2007 04:20:05 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Israel has NOT conceded Shabaa Farms, the newspaper Ha'aretz has.  In any event is kidnapping, murder and rocket attacks the best way to resolve the matter?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Israel has NOT conceded Shabaa Farms, the newspaper Ha&#8217;aretz has.  In any event is kidnapping, murder and rocket attacks the best way to resolve the matter?</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Silverstein</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/05/31/dersh-and-plaut-lie-down-with-dogs-get-up-with-fleas/#comment-23099</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Silverstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Jun 2007 21:50:18 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;The UN ruled that when Barak unilaterally pulled Israeli forces out of southern Lebanon that the withdrawal had been complete to the recognized international border.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
You are forgetting Shebaa Farms, which even Israel concedes it has no claim to.  The territory is either Lebanese or Syrian (depending who you speak to) &#038; the conflict can only be fully resolved when this territory is returned.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>The UN ruled that when Barak unilaterally pulled Israeli forces out of southern Lebanon that the withdrawal had been complete to the recognized international border.</p></blockquote>
<p>You are forgetting Shebaa Farms, which even Israel concedes it has no claim to.  The territory is either Lebanese or Syrian (depending who you speak to) &#038; the conflict can only be fully resolved when this territory is returned.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Silverstein</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/05/31/dersh-and-plaut-lie-down-with-dogs-get-up-with-fleas/#comment-23098</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Silverstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Jun 2007 21:48:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/05/31/dersh-and-plaut-lie-down-with-dogs-get-up-with-fleas/#comment-23098</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Plaut’s defence was lame&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Someone quite involved with this case also told me that Plaut's defense was extremely poor.

Compare the 2 cases of which you speak: in one case Gordon wrote a review of a book &#038; was called a Judenrat for his troubles.  In the case you mention, an Israeli officer committed a human rights violation possibly involving death (you don't provide the particulars so I can't say precisely what happened) which Gordon judged worthy of being considered a war crime.  Admittedly, no court has yet found the officer guilty of such a crime.  But is it your contention that such a charge and conviction are so beyond the realm of possibility that no reasonable person or court could ever draw such a conclusion?  In the Plaut case, no reasonable person could ever construe Gordon as a Judenrat or Jew for Nazis.  Only a lunatic like Plaut could believe such a thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Plaut’s defence was lame</p></blockquote>
<p>Someone quite involved with this case also told me that Plaut&#8217;s defense was extremely poor.</p>
<p>Compare the 2 cases of which you speak: in one case Gordon wrote a review of a book &#038; was called a Judenrat for his troubles.  In the case you mention, an Israeli officer committed a human rights violation possibly involving death (you don&#8217;t provide the particulars so I can&#8217;t say precisely what happened) which Gordon judged worthy of being considered a war crime.  Admittedly, no court has yet found the officer guilty of such a crime.  But is it your contention that such a charge and conviction are so beyond the realm of possibility that no reasonable person or court could ever draw such a conclusion?  In the Plaut case, no reasonable person could ever construe Gordon as a Judenrat or Jew for Nazis.  Only a lunatic like Plaut could believe such a thing.</p>
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		<title>By: imjudy</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/05/31/dersh-and-plaut-lie-down-with-dogs-get-up-with-fleas/#comment-23092</link>
		<dc:creator>imjudy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Jun 2007 20:14:08 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>The UN ruled that when Barak unilaterally pulled Israeli forces out of southern Lebanon that the withdrawal had been complete to the recognized international border. Then please explain how Finkelstein can support "Hizbullah's fight against Israeli occupation of Lebanese territory", as you put it? You also mention "Syrian territory", but Hizbullah does not
operate on Syrian territory, nor does it represent Syria, so how can Finkelstein support Hizbullah aggression against Israel?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The UN ruled that when Barak unilaterally pulled Israeli forces out of southern Lebanon that the withdrawal had been complete to the recognized international border. Then please explain how Finkelstein can support &#8220;Hizbullah&#8217;s fight against Israeli occupation of Lebanese territory&#8221;, as you put it? You also mention &#8220;Syrian territory&#8221;, but Hizbullah does not<br />
operate on Syrian territory, nor does it represent Syria, so how can Finkelstein support Hizbullah aggression against Israel?</p>
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		<title>By: amir</title>
		<link>http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2007/05/31/dersh-and-plaut-lie-down-with-dogs-get-up-with-fleas/#comment-23039</link>
		<dc:creator>amir</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Jun 2007 09:58:33 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Correction. Not -“how does it feel to be war criminal?”  but "how did you become a war criminal?"</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Correction. Not -“how does it feel to be war criminal?”  but &#8220;how did you become a war criminal?&#8221;</p>
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